Help
Salam alaykum everybody,
I have been reading this page for months and yet last night happened something which lead me to write here and asking you what to do.
My 25 year old brother handed me a 4 pages letter last night, saying he is gay. In it he described that he has been feeling that way all his life. Having guy cruses in school and so on. I realised how hard must have been for him, so I acted as if it was not a big deal. He asked me if I hated him now, and I said, no way I wish him only to be happy and it`s a hard world out there. Inside I was very confused and the first thing that came to my mind was, he will never have children and get married. He is a good person, may I say that he is also very handsome, girls are crazy about him and he never responded truly, only pretended. Yes he showed interest in girls, dated some of them and in his letter he told me that he doesn`t want to get married and make some poor girl unhappy, even though that was his plan before.
Last year he was being "friends" with a guy, we all knew was gay, but deeply devotet Muslim, so I told him not to see him, not knowing my brother was gay.
I told him not to tell our parents, because the reaction of my father would probably be not to accept him. My older brother is a homophobe, a rather strict person. I am affraid what this might mean for his future. There is no family member who would not judge him, so I believe he shouldn`t tell anybody and let the secret die with me and him. But they will start asking questions, why doesn`t he get married and so forth. When he told me, I just told him we should go out and have something to eat, we did that. We talked a bit and he told me that he only wants to be loved, can`t live in a lie. And there I was looking at him. My tall, good looking, highly educated brother, will have an unfulfilling life. The worst part was when he told me, he would still like to be a father someday and I said, how, and he responded, well somehow. I could die in that moment, because it is him lying to himself again. Why did this happen? Is it a test from God?
I gues I just needed to share this with somebody, it is probably no different to stories of other people. I am still confused, It`s been only 10 hours sinse he told me.
My brother just came out to me
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#2
Anderson 
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 04:27 AM
A friend of mine was gay and began an affair with this white guy named Christian while he was engaged to this girl called Ameerah. Anyway he tried to control his feelings and broke off the gay relationship just before he got married to Ameerah. So everything was fine but they started having sex problems cos Ameerah was too feminine for him to get turned on and he started being gay again for Christian.
They ended up doing loads of gay stuff together (sexually) but then they got found out and battered by Ameerah's dad who was a gangster.
Also they found out she was pregnant and that Christian had aids.
They ended up doing loads of gay stuff together (sexually) but then they got found out and battered by Ameerah's dad who was a gangster.
Also they found out she was pregnant and that Christian had aids.
Cheesecake and webcams.
#3
zzze
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 06:10 AM
What, since when did Christian have aids?
I think you can make du'a for him. I would say it's probably best he doesn't tell your dad...what's it going to achieve? Just do what other under cover gay guys do and appear to be overly critical of any girl suggested. Unless he's overtly camp they might just assume he has unrealistic standards/asexual or both.
I think you can make du'a for him. I would say it's probably best he doesn't tell your dad...what's it going to achieve? Just do what other under cover gay guys do and appear to be overly critical of any girl suggested. Unless he's overtly camp they might just assume he has unrealistic standards/asexual or both.
"Until you annihilate your selfish lower self of desires and lusts through strict and sincere mujahada [self disciplinary exercises], your heart will never become illuminated with the light of knowledge." - Imam Abu Hamid Al-Ghazli, Dear Beloved Son.
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#4
Family
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 06:24 AM
zzze said:
What, since when did Christian have aids?
I think you can make du'a for him. I would say it's probably best he doesn't tell your dad...what's it going to achieve? Just do what other under cover gay guys do and appear to be overly critical of any girl suggested. Unless he's overtly camp they might just assume he has unrealistic standards/asexual or both.
I think you can make du'a for him. I would say it's probably best he doesn't tell your dad...what's it going to achieve? Just do what other under cover gay guys do and appear to be overly critical of any girl suggested. Unless he's overtly camp they might just assume he has unrealistic standards/asexual or both.
I gues that`s what he will have to do. No, he is not camp, he is somebody who can`t for example fix things in the house, and never was into helping father arround the house like my older brother. He would let women do hard chores and I had a feeling, he might be gay, but..well. He was more into art and stuff and is an artist by profession now.
This morning he told me we should all just stop pressuring him to find a girl and that he also likes for example pretty girls who dress like man. So maybe there is still hope he might be bisexual and could change. What do you think?
#6
zzze
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 08:45 AM
That's not even a triangle.
Family: I can't determine whether he's bisexual. It depends if he meant he's attracted to butch women or he likes the way they dress...?
Obviously it'd be a much easier life for your brother if he was bisexual, and you'd feel reassured. Especially if he's a believer, it's a very difficult thing to reconcile. I hope he figures it out insha Allah, he's very lucky that you're being so understanding
Family: I can't determine whether he's bisexual. It depends if he meant he's attracted to butch women or he likes the way they dress...?
Obviously it'd be a much easier life for your brother if he was bisexual, and you'd feel reassured. Especially if he's a believer, it's a very difficult thing to reconcile. I hope he figures it out insha Allah, he's very lucky that you're being so understanding
"Until you annihilate your selfish lower self of desires and lusts through strict and sincere mujahada [self disciplinary exercises], your heart will never become illuminated with the light of knowledge." - Imam Abu Hamid Al-Ghazli, Dear Beloved Son.
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#7
BaronChairman
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 09:33 AM
Maybe it's a test from God to see if you can accept your brother as a homosexual and keep a strong and healthy famlial relationship with him through your obvious disagreement with it.
I'm sorry if my insensitivity toward your beliefs offends you. But guess what - your religious wars, jihads, crusades, inquisitions, censoring of free speech, brainwashing of children, murdering of albinos, forcing girls into underage marriages, female genital mutilation, stoning, pederasty, homophobia, and rejection of science and reason offend ME. So I guess we're even.
#8
Variable
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 09:41 AM
Family said:
No, he is not camp, he is somebody who can`t for example fix things in the house, and never was into helping father arround the house like my older brother. He would let women do hard chores and I had a feeling, he might be gay, but..well. He was more into art and stuff and is an artist by profession now.
If those are indicators for being gay... probably more than half the guys on this forum are hahahahah.
What kind of peace do I mean and what kind of a peace do we seek? Not a Pax Americana enforced on the world by American weapons of war.... not merely peace for Americans but peace for all men and women -- not merely peace in our time, but peace in all time.
JFK
JFK
#9
Jaysh
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 10:33 AM
Family said:
Salam alaykum everybody,
I have been reading this page for months and yet last night happened something which lead me to write here and asking you what to do.
My 25 year old brother handed me a 4 pages letter last night, saying he is gay. In it he described that he has been feeling that way all his life. Having guy cruses in school and so on. I realised how hard must have been for him, so I acted as if it was not a big deal. He asked me if I hated him now, and I said, no way I wish him only to be happy and it`s a hard world out there. Inside I was very confused and the first thing that came to my mind was, he will never have children and get married. He is a good person, may I say that he is also very handsome, girls are crazy about him and he never responded truly, only pretended. Yes he showed interest in girls, dated some of them and in his letter he told me that he doesn`t want to get married and make some poor girl unhappy, even though that was his plan before.
Last year he was being "friends" with a guy, we all knew was gay, but deeply devotet Muslim, so I told him not to see him, not knowing my brother was gay.
I told him not to tell our parents, because the reaction of my father would probably be not to accept him. My older brother is a homophobe, a rather strict person. I am affraid what this might mean for his future. There is no family member who would not judge him, so I believe he shouldn`t tell anybody and let the secret die with me and him. But they will start asking questions, why doesn`t he get married and so forth. When he told me, I just told him we should go out and have something to eat, we did that. We talked a bit and he told me that he only wants to be loved, can`t live in a lie. And there I was looking at him. My tall, good looking, highly educated brother, will have an unfulfilling life. The worst part was when he told me, he would still like to be a father someday and I said, how, and he responded, well somehow. I could die in that moment, because it is him lying to himself again. Why did this happen? Is it a test from God?
I gues I just needed to share this with somebody, it is probably no different to stories of other people. I am still confused, It`s been only 10 hours sinse he told me.
I have been reading this page for months and yet last night happened something which lead me to write here and asking you what to do.
My 25 year old brother handed me a 4 pages letter last night, saying he is gay. In it he described that he has been feeling that way all his life. Having guy cruses in school and so on. I realised how hard must have been for him, so I acted as if it was not a big deal. He asked me if I hated him now, and I said, no way I wish him only to be happy and it`s a hard world out there. Inside I was very confused and the first thing that came to my mind was, he will never have children and get married. He is a good person, may I say that he is also very handsome, girls are crazy about him and he never responded truly, only pretended. Yes he showed interest in girls, dated some of them and in his letter he told me that he doesn`t want to get married and make some poor girl unhappy, even though that was his plan before.
Last year he was being "friends" with a guy, we all knew was gay, but deeply devotet Muslim, so I told him not to see him, not knowing my brother was gay.
I told him not to tell our parents, because the reaction of my father would probably be not to accept him. My older brother is a homophobe, a rather strict person. I am affraid what this might mean for his future. There is no family member who would not judge him, so I believe he shouldn`t tell anybody and let the secret die with me and him. But they will start asking questions, why doesn`t he get married and so forth. When he told me, I just told him we should go out and have something to eat, we did that. We talked a bit and he told me that he only wants to be loved, can`t live in a lie. And there I was looking at him. My tall, good looking, highly educated brother, will have an unfulfilling life. The worst part was when he told me, he would still like to be a father someday and I said, how, and he responded, well somehow. I could die in that moment, because it is him lying to himself again. Why did this happen? Is it a test from God?
I gues I just needed to share this with somebody, it is probably no different to stories of other people. I am still confused, It`s been only 10 hours sinse he told me.
Are you Muslim? I am assuming you and your brother are.
Homosexual acts are a sin in Islam, and you can't ever change that.
But there is no reason to be a homophobe, or to hate him, or to humiliate him, or to kick him out of the family, etc.
Be kind and merciful to him, as we should be with all humans. I think the story of Prophet Lot (as) in the Quran is very telling, in that Lot (as) was always very soft and kind to his people, at most only pleading with them. He (as) didn't ever want to give up on them, and it was only God Who issued the judgment against them. So it is up to God to be the judge, not you or I.
If your brother is committed to being a good Muslim, then he can adopt a life of monasticism, as the people before our nation used to do.
If not, then pray for him, be kind to him, and lightly admonish him in ways that are most beautiful. Even though you want to make sure you don't trivialize the sin, you must always remind him not to despair of the Mercy of Allah (swt).
Fi Aman Allah
Be like a rose which gives its fragrance even to those who crush it. - Ali (RA)
#10
Family
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 10:58 AM
Jaysh said:
Are you Muslim? I am assuming you and your brother are.
Homosexual acts are a sin in Islam, and you can't ever change that.
But there is no reason to be a homophobe, or to hate him, or to humiliate him, or to kick him out of the family, etc.
Be kind and merciful to him, as we should be with all humans. I think the story of Prophet Lot (as) in the Quran is very telling, in that Lot (as) was always very soft and kind to his people, at most only pleading with them. He (as) didn't ever want to give up on them, and it was only God Who issued the judgment against them. So it is up to God to be the judge, not you or I.
If your brother is committed to being a good Muslim, then he can adopt a life of monasticism, as the people before our nation used to do.
If not, then pray for him, be kind to him, and lightly admonish him in ways that are most beautiful. Even though you want to make sure you don't trivialize the sin, you must always remind him not to despair of the Mercy of Allah (swt).
Fi Aman Allah
Homosexual acts are a sin in Islam, and you can't ever change that.
But there is no reason to be a homophobe, or to hate him, or to humiliate him, or to kick him out of the family, etc.
Be kind and merciful to him, as we should be with all humans. I think the story of Prophet Lot (as) in the Quran is very telling, in that Lot (as) was always very soft and kind to his people, at most only pleading with them. He (as) didn't ever want to give up on them, and it was only God Who issued the judgment against them. So it is up to God to be the judge, not you or I.
If your brother is committed to being a good Muslim, then he can adopt a life of monasticism, as the people before our nation used to do.
If not, then pray for him, be kind to him, and lightly admonish him in ways that are most beautiful. Even though you want to make sure you don't trivialize the sin, you must always remind him not to despair of the Mercy of Allah (swt).
Fi Aman Allah
Yes we are Muslims and I love my brother more than anybody in this world. I would neve hurth him, I just want him to he happy.
Blue_Phoenix said:
Maybe it's a test from God to see if you can accept your brother as a homosexual and keep a strong and healthy famlial relationship with him through your obvious disagreement with it.
I am not a homophobe, I only know that it is a hard world gor gay people out there, I didn`t want my family member to have to face it, but sinse it is so, I will do all to help him.
[quote name='zzze']That's not even a triangle.
Family: I can't determine whether he's bisexual. It depends if he meant he's attracted to butch women or he likes the way they dress...?
Obviously it'd be a much easier life for your brother if he was bisexual, and you'd feel reassured. Especially if he's a believer, it's a very difficult thing to reconcile. I hope he figures it out insha Allah, he's very lucky that you're being so understanding
[/QUOTEThank you, may you be blessed.]
#13
EirinnMoChroi
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 02:03 PM
Family said:
This morning he told me we should all just stop pressuring him to find a girl and that he also likes for example pretty girls who dress like man. So maybe there is still hope he might be bisexual and could change. What do you think?
I dont believe that "change" is going to happen since, if you ask most gay people, they will tell you that they were born gay and have been gay their entire life. If he sees "butch" girls to be more attractive and can get sexually aroused by her, than yes, he is bisexual and can just marry a butch girl. But bisexuality doesnt mean you can change. It just means you can hide it a little easier. lol.
Jaysh said:
Are you Muslim? I am assuming you and your brother are.
Homosexual acts are a sin in Islam, and you can't ever change that.
But there is no reason to be a homophobe, or to hate him, or to humiliate him, or to kick him out of the family, etc.
Be kind and merciful to him, as we should be with all humans. I think the story of Prophet Lot (as) in the Quran is very telling, in that Lot (as) was always very soft and kind to his people, at most only pleading with them. He (as) didn't ever want to give up on them, and it was only God Who issued the judgment against them. So it is up to God to be the judge, not you or I.
If your brother is committed to being a good Muslim, then he can adopt a life of monasticism, as the people before our nation used to do.
If not, then pray for him, be kind to him, and lightly admonish him in ways that are most beautiful. Even though you want to make sure you don't trivialize the sin, you must always remind him not to despair of the Mercy of Allah (swt).
Fi Aman Allah
Homosexual acts are a sin in Islam, and you can't ever change that.
But there is no reason to be a homophobe, or to hate him, or to humiliate him, or to kick him out of the family, etc.
Be kind and merciful to him, as we should be with all humans. I think the story of Prophet Lot (as) in the Quran is very telling, in that Lot (as) was always very soft and kind to his people, at most only pleading with them. He (as) didn't ever want to give up on them, and it was only God Who issued the judgment against them. So it is up to God to be the judge, not you or I.
If your brother is committed to being a good Muslim, then he can adopt a life of monasticism, as the people before our nation used to do.
If not, then pray for him, be kind to him, and lightly admonish him in ways that are most beautiful. Even though you want to make sure you don't trivialize the sin, you must always remind him not to despair of the Mercy of Allah (swt).
Fi Aman Allah
another good one from New Jaysh.
#14
nunyobeezwax
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 02:20 PM
Family, I'm really sorry to hear about this. I feel really bad for your brother, it must be really hard for him. And kudos to him for deciding against marrying a woman just because others would think that's the best thing to do.. I hope he can figure things out. During this time it's very important not to focus on yourself as being hurt or as the victim because he needs your full support, especially if the rest of your family finds out. 
-----
Umm, it's easy to recommend celibacy but "leading a life of monasticism" isn't any easier for gay people. Imagine you're a heterosexual, practicing Muslim man, but for some reason you cannot get married...No. Matter. What. Not only can you not have sex, but you also can't enjoy companionship because it would go against your beliefs to have that kind of relationship outside marriage. You'd never have your own kids, grandkids or a traditional family. Wouldn't you go insane?
People like Family's poor brother would have to work very hard to reach a level of discipline at which they could accept that they will spend their lives without sex or the type of companionship they naturally gravitate towards. Being alone without a companion is not a natural state for most human beings, and sometimes even good friends can't fill that void.
-----
Umm, it's easy to recommend celibacy but "leading a life of monasticism" isn't any easier for gay people. Imagine you're a heterosexual, practicing Muslim man, but for some reason you cannot get married...No. Matter. What. Not only can you not have sex, but you also can't enjoy companionship because it would go against your beliefs to have that kind of relationship outside marriage. You'd never have your own kids, grandkids or a traditional family. Wouldn't you go insane?
People like Family's poor brother would have to work very hard to reach a level of discipline at which they could accept that they will spend their lives without sex or the type of companionship they naturally gravitate towards. Being alone without a companion is not a natural state for most human beings, and sometimes even good friends can't fill that void.
#15
TrentReznor858
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 02:46 PM
Ironic that people are fighting to defend someones choice to marry a 9 year old on one thread, saying "oh its part of the culture back then yada yada yada" while recommending someone be celibate because they have no interest in sexual relationships with the opposite sex. Maybe you could extend that "culture" excuse to these muslims as well?
Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry,their passions a quotation - Oscar Wilde.
A wise person, does not, on account of an ugly and tattered veil, fail to pay attention to a beautiful face; and an understanding person does not, becasue fo bitter skin, throw away the delicious substance of a fruit. - Muhammad bin abdur Rahman Ebrahim
A dream is the answer to a question we do not know how to ask - Fox Mulder.
A wise person, does not, on account of an ugly and tattered veil, fail to pay attention to a beautiful face; and an understanding person does not, becasue fo bitter skin, throw away the delicious substance of a fruit. - Muhammad bin abdur Rahman Ebrahim
A dream is the answer to a question we do not know how to ask - Fox Mulder.
#16
Family
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 02:51 PM
thejellymill said:
Family, I'm really sorry to hear about this. I feel really bad for your brother, it must be really hard for him. And kudos to him for deciding against marrying a woman just because others would think that's the best thing to do.. I hope he can figure things out. During this time it's very important not to focus on yourself as being hurt or as the victim because he needs your full support, especially if the rest of your family finds out.
-----
Umm, it's easy to recommend celibacy but "leading a life of monasticism" isn't any easier for gay people. Imagine you're a heterosexual, practicing Muslim man, but for some reason you cannot get married...No. Matter. What. Not only can you not have sex, but you also can't enjoy companionship because it would go against your beliefs to have that kind of relationship outside marriage. You'd never have your own kids, grandkids or a traditional family. Wouldn't you go insane?
People like Family's poor brother would have to work very hard to reach a level of discipline at which they could accept that they will spend their lives without sex or the type of companionship they naturally gravitate towards. Being alone without a companion is not a natural state for most human beings, and sometimes even good friends can't fill that void.
-----
Umm, it's easy to recommend celibacy but "leading a life of monasticism" isn't any easier for gay people. Imagine you're a heterosexual, practicing Muslim man, but for some reason you cannot get married...No. Matter. What. Not only can you not have sex, but you also can't enjoy companionship because it would go against your beliefs to have that kind of relationship outside marriage. You'd never have your own kids, grandkids or a traditional family. Wouldn't you go insane?
People like Family's poor brother would have to work very hard to reach a level of discipline at which they could accept that they will spend their lives without sex or the type of companionship they naturally gravitate towards. Being alone without a companion is not a natural state for most human beings, and sometimes even good friends can't fill that void.
Yes I agree with you. In his letter he told me that he is sick of not having a feeling of being loved and that is hard, especially because he loves the idea of having a family.
#17
DawudIsrael
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 03:44 PM
There are communities out there for practicing Muslims who have gay tendencies, like a support group to keep them on the Straight Path. I think there is one online, which I will try to find and message to you.
There are other Muslims who are outwardly gay and Muslim, but don't use Islam to justify their homosexuality, whereas there are others who do. And then there are brothers who are just confused- one dude I knew, who wasn't gay but brainwashed into thinking he was. Others just get raped or sexual abuse when they are young and that transforms them into homosexuals. There's a lot of reasons out there.
And yes, its just a trial, he can endure. And he can avoid praying in jamaah in the masjid, or being near men, and heck probably it would be better for him then to keep female friends- he would be without sin, if he is gay and not bisexual. He's not the usual case, so the strict rules of Islam change for him (the mukhanath used to mix with the wives of the Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam and were told to leave when there was doubt as to whether they were attracted to women as well). Very few people are actually strictly homosexual/heterosexual, many people are somewhere in between- having thoughts, at the very least for both genders- and even then, it is still a struggle against the nafs.
One of the righteous shaykhs mentioned in Kashf al-Mahjub is recorded as saying:
And with Allah is Tawfique. Barakallahu feek!
There are other Muslims who are outwardly gay and Muslim, but don't use Islam to justify their homosexuality, whereas there are others who do. And then there are brothers who are just confused- one dude I knew, who wasn't gay but brainwashed into thinking he was. Others just get raped or sexual abuse when they are young and that transforms them into homosexuals. There's a lot of reasons out there.
And yes, its just a trial, he can endure. And he can avoid praying in jamaah in the masjid, or being near men, and heck probably it would be better for him then to keep female friends- he would be without sin, if he is gay and not bisexual. He's not the usual case, so the strict rules of Islam change for him (the mukhanath used to mix with the wives of the Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam and were told to leave when there was doubt as to whether they were attracted to women as well). Very few people are actually strictly homosexual/heterosexual, many people are somewhere in between- having thoughts, at the very least for both genders- and even then, it is still a struggle against the nafs.
One of the righteous shaykhs mentioned in Kashf al-Mahjub is recorded as saying:
“There is no flame of lust that cannot be extinguished by strenuous effort, because what vice proceeds from yourself, you possess the instrument that will remove it, another is not necessary for that purpose.”
Lastly remember this life is transitory, temporary and not permanent. We live in but the moment, a fragment of space-time, where we only really need to resist something in the "now," which is gone 5 seconds later. So it's only for a little while he has to endure this- it's nothing compared to the ocean of the Akhirah. And with Allah is Tawfique. Barakallahu feek!
#19
Revert
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 04:32 PM
Wolfn said:
My brother is a Satanist. I think that's worse than being attracted to the same sex.
Not really, your brothers emo fascination with the devil will wear off. This guys brother will be gay forever.
Family,
The best thing you can do for your brother is well, be a brother to him. Listen to his worries and offer good advice. Stuff like "Don;t be gay" "Homosexuality is a sin" will work against you. Be sincere and honest but also be respectful, he's still your brother at the end of the day.
ChotooMotoo said:
In that case, you should get on your knees and thank my Scandinavian ancestors cuz all yr asweomess r belong 2 VIKING rape babies
#20
Rain
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Posted 08 May 2010 - 06:03 PM
TrentReznor858 said:
Ironic that people are fighting to defend someones choice to marry a 9 year old on one thread, saying "oh its part of the culture back then yada yada yada" while recommending someone be celibate because they have no interest in sexual relationships with the opposite sex. Maybe you could extend that "culture" excuse to these muslims as well?
sorry, I don't quite understand - the Prophet (SAW) married (H) Aysha when she was 8/9 and this guy's brother is gay. what's your point?
