Saying Salam to the Opposite Gender

[IbnMardhiyah]

You sir, are blowing this outta proportion and creating a mountain of of a molehill.

Originally Posted by Jaysh

So you are admitting that HALF of all men cannot give salams to a hot girl without thinking things.

We're men. Stuff is always on our mind. We're always thinking "things". We're thinking about hot cars, hot women, sharp suits, and more hot women. This is nothing new and everyone knows it. We are not held accountable for what may occur in our minds as a result of our nature. We are however held accountable for what we say or do.

I was talking about the guys I know. Yes, some of the guys I know hit on girls when they're in public places. Work, school, malls, conferences, weddings, blah blah blah.
That hardly equates to half of "all men"that exist, however, thank you for the note of confidence, I'm quite flattered.

Why then, good sir, are you criticizing the need to discourage the salams then?

Because in our Deen, we are encouraged to actively spread salaams. Plain and simple. Don't make this complicated, and don't go to extremes. If you know of any explicit command in the Qur'an and Sunnah where its forbidden or even strongly discouraged to give salaams to the opposite gender, then please bring it.

Otherwise to me it seems like you're acting like that Sahabi who thought it would be better for him if he just stayed away from women to the point of complete celibacy. That is wrong, and I think this is wrong too - telling us we cant give salaams to girls.

I really think you missed the entire point of the Barseesa story. The moral of the story was that all things start out small. In that case, it started out as something very small. In that story, it started out with a greeting, I do believe.

It did not.

If you go back and read the story, it started when he thought he should knock on the door to "tell her" that her bread was there on her doorstep, even though he already knew that she was taking the bread after he was leaving it on her doorstep everyday without a word being spoken at all.

Otherwise if I go by your example, then many, many parts of Islam would be discouraged or even blacklisted because they MIGHT lead to haraam.

Should we all live in a cardboard box with blinders on our eyes or what?

[Ilikemyscarf]

I never initiate salams with a brother..if they say salam to me, I reply. However, I try to give my sisters a big smile and a salams.

[sumiyia]

Originally Posted by Jaysh

OK, good luck. Salams.

walaikum assalam wa rahmatullah.


be careful though, brother. this may lead to fitna.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Honestly its really simple:

Men and women are both told to guard the tone, pitch, inflection, etc. of their voices when speaking to the opposite gender. Because its not what you say, its how you say it. You can say a greeting in a flat tone, properly pronounced, and it will convey nothing except what it is - a polite greeting.

You could say the exact same greeting in a sultry manner or low-octave voice and it sends a completely different message, one filled with fitnah and whatever. Body language is also huge. A polite nod of the head is what I use to accompany my salaams to the opposite gender or to men who I do not know that well. If I were to say salaams to a girl and stretch parts of the greeting, or lower the tone and pitch, and along with it - grin mischievously, or wink an eye, or c0ck my head to the side, or tilt my body suggestively, then you can blame me until you're blue in the face and I wouldn't disagree.

Jaysh, you probably want to refine your message a bit to advise people to be careful about their voice and body language when conversing with the opposite gender - because this is the exact same thing we were so advised in our Deen.

[sumiyia]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

Honestly its really simple:

Men and women are both told to guard the tone, pitch, inflection, etc. of their voices when speaking to the opposite gender. Because its not what you say, its how you say it. You can say a greeting in a flat tone, properly pronounced, and it will convey nothing except what it is - a polite greeting.

You could say the exact same greeting in a sultry manner or low-octave voice and it sends a completely different message, one filled with fitnah and whatever. Body language is also huge. A polite nod of the head is what I use to accompany my salaams to the opposite gender or to men who I do not know that well. If I were to say salaams to a girl and stretch parts of the greeting, or lower the tone and pitch, and along with it - grin mischievously, or wink an eye, or c0ck my head to the side, or tilt my body suggestively, then you can blame me until you're blue in the face and I wouldn't disagree.

Jaysh, you probably want to refine your message a bit to advise people to be careful about their voice and body language when conversing with the opposite gender - because this is the exact same thing we were so advised in our Deen.

haha.. once after jummah i saw this sleezy guy do everything bolded above and say "masha'allahhhhhhh" to a sister walking past him.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by sumiyia

haha.. once after jummah i saw this sleezy guy do everything bolded above and say "masha'allahhhhhhh" to a sister walking past him.

serious question ... Do you think it would have had any use if, right at that moment you had thrown the nearest chappal at his head, and called him out publicly for his behavior?

[dreamdeferred]

Originally Posted by sumiyia

haha.. once after jummah i saw this sleezy guy do everything bolded above and say "masha'allahhhhhhh" to a sister walking past him.

There's nothing worse than players that try to Islam-ify their shady macking efforts.

Settle down playas.

[sixpakistan]

Originally Posted by sumiyia

but in any event, 70 excuses and such.

70 excuses to my knowledge is in the context of sin. Those guys aren't doing anything sinful. In fact, they're trying to avoid any possibility of anything inappropriate. To criticize them for that and speak as though you're excusing some gunaa on their part is unfair.

Why do you think they don't say salaams to females? Coz they hate women? Or because if they did, they'd lose control of their raging hormones and turn into beasts? It doesn't seem like either of those things is very likely. :P

[sumiyia]

Originally Posted by sixpakistan

70 excuses to my knowledge is in the context of sin. Those guys aren't doing anything sinful. In fact, they're trying to avoid any possibility of anything inappropriate. To criticize them for that and speak as though you're excusing some gunaa on their part is unfair.

Why do you think they don't say salaams to females? Coz they hate women? Or because if they did, they'd lose control of their raging hormones and turn into beasts? It doesn't seem like either of those things is very likely. :P

that was not my intention. i'm not accusing them of doing anything sinful. however, to me personally it is disrespectful.

[ChotooMotoo]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

serious question ... Do you think it would have had any use if, right at that moment you had thrown the nearest chappal at his head, and called him out publicly for his behavior?

Not publicly.

Sometimes you do have to point it out though. In my early days as a Muslim my job didn't allow me to wear hijab. I would wear it to work, and put it on again when I left. We had this one Muslim guy who used to STARE at me when I was leaving. It really bothered me. One time it was really bad, he actually stopped walking to stare at me. It was just the two of us in the hallway between the break room and the store. I just politely said salams to him and asked him not to stare at me.

He never stared again. We had normal co-worker interactions from then onwards.

[spicyhijabi]

Originally Posted by sixpakistan

70 excuses to my knowledge is in the context of sin. Those guys aren't doing anything sinful. In fact, they're trying to avoid any possibility of anything inappropriate. To criticize them for that and speak as though you're excusing some gunaa on their part is unfair.

Why do you think they don't say salaams to females? Coz they hate women? Or because if they did, they'd lose control of their raging hormones and turn into beasts? It doesn't seem like either of those things is very likely. :P

What is gunaa?
I googled it and nothing came up..

Nevermind I figured it out.
Its sin (right?).

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by ChotooMotoo

Not publicly.

Yea the reason I posed that question is, if the guy was leering in public, then shouldn't the response be public? particularly if you see the guy doing it often, in public.

[sumiyia]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

Yea the reason I posed that question is, if the guy was leering in public, then shouldn't the response be public? particularly if you see the guy doing it often, in public.

idunno... i just got scared and left.


i was the sister he made that comment to.

[ChotooMotoo]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

Yea the reason I posed that question is, if the guy was leering in public, then shouldn't the response be public? particularly if you see the guy doing it often, in public.

I dunno. To me personally it's not useful to do it publicly. He might not be aware that he's doing it , he might not be aware how it makes you feel. If he has a bunch of friends with him, they might make a scene about it, which could turn against you even though he was the one doing wrong. I think a private reprimand would be a better first option.

[wheelworks]

I carry a tone meter around with me so when I give salams I check the meter to make sure the needle reads in the halal unattractive tone zone