[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by thejellymill

If you look back at my original comment in the thread you would see that the point I am trying to make here is that jaysh never gets banned because he's been here longer and is friends with others who have also been around forever, some of whom are now moderators. However, new people that do the same thing as he does (spew bigoted garbage, make needless threads, reply to others with disrespect and declare people kafirs) get banned in a second.

That's misrepresenting it.

A lot of the bans are temporary, and often times Jaysh comes back via spoofing services and with another nick.

I think Jaysh and Got5 might be tied for the most number of bans from Islamica in its entire history, but the bans aren't always forever and ever.

Speaking of which ... where the hell is Got5?

[ShamilB]

Originally Posted by thejellymill

You seem to be implying that I am rejecting some part of the original post. Please stop telling me what I'm trying to say, I know what I'm trying to say but you are missing my point. I agree wholeheartedly with the fact that mocking the sunnah might take one out of the fold of Islam, that is not the problem here.

The problem is jaysh posts these commonly known facts just for kicks because he obviously has nothing else to do (the fact that he's on here almost 24/7 posting a new thread every hour is a good clue). He often responds to those he disagrees with in a disrespectful, sometimes outright rude or even hateful manner and insults other groups. Plus didn't he once declare takfir on shadha or something? Isn't that why he got banned in the first place?

If you look back at my original comment in the thread you would see that the point I am trying to make here is that jaysh never gets banned because he's been here longer and is friends with others who have also been around forever, some of whom are now moderators. However, new people that do the same thing as he does (spew bigoted garbage, make needless threads, reply to others with disrespect and declare people kafirs) get banned in a second.

So are you telling me you (and revert) didn't find this the least bit insulting? Btw, these two messages were posted before Jaysh's "hateful garbage".

Posted by rahat:

Why do sunni sects focus sooooooooooooooooooo much on declaring other kufr.

this certainly was not the "sunnah" of the Prophet.

And then this:

if a group is actually outside the fold of islam, then sure we do stuff like that, but it has never been a focus to even 1/100th the degree displayed by modern day sunnis.

i mean the original post has nothing technically wrong with it, make fun of the prophet = off to hell, the the difference is that focusing so much on making sure everyone else is a kafir is rather unwarranted.

Maybe your anger should be directed at rahat's snide remarks instead.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by rahat

1. A "Nasibi" is someone who hates the Ahlul Bayt. Even the Sunni madhabs declare a Nasibi to be Kafir. If you don't hate the Ahlul Bayt, this does not apply to you.

What others were trying to point out is that Shias apply that term quite liberally to anyone they hate. The end result is still the same - takfeer.

And lets not anyone deny that the overwhelming majority of the members of this forum are Sunni, and in this board - the overwhelming majority of conversations are focused on ensuring that someone is a kafir.

I deny that completely and entirely.

It is gross and hyperbolic exaggeration.

[thejellymill]

Ah so you read fph eh? At any rate, posting in fph about my new shirt or pimple medicine is safer than posting stuff that puts me at risk for committing a sin by wrongly insulting or offending somebody.

As for posting "evidence" for bigoted remarks, it is obvious enough that I don't need to go search out proof for you. I am not the only one who thinks jaysh's tactics, beliefs and language can be offensive.

Unlike some people, I do not have all day to sit around on islamica and bicker about common sense issues and grammar rules so I must now take my leave. Salaam.

[thejellymill]

Originally Posted by ShamilB

Maybe your anger should be directed at rahat's snide remarks instead.

My original comment was comparing people like rahat, heartbreaker, jaysh etc. I asked how come they get disciplined but jaysh doesnt, how come they are attacked by other members for the trash they speak but jaysh doesnt? I never said rahat was right and if you look in another thread titled 'war on iran' you will see that I disagreed with heartbreaker's rude way of dealing with jaysh's rude comments.

Plus I don't like to get into sectarian arguments.

[rahat]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

What others were trying to point out is that Shias apply that term quite liberally to anyone they hate. The end result is still the same - takfeer.

No - we do not.

Maybe a particular website does - but when you hang around thousands of shias (as I have over the course of my life) the focus of conversations about sunnis is "Why do they believe all these lies about us?" or "How can we get wahabis to stop killing us" [in all seriousness] - its never "They are kaffir" or "they are nasibi" or any related topic.

For example, I have, in my head, beliefs about certain individuals I know who purport to be Muslim but whos actions and words, in my personal opinion, make them raging hypocrites. I have never spoken these words out loud to another Shia, much less anyone else: i.e. it would be a wierd and unusual conversation for me to talk to even a fellow Shia about calling someone a kaffir and so forth - even if they were from another sect, my own sect, or any permutation you want.

I'm talking about cultural attitudes, not the fiqh of calling a belief outside the fold of islam.

-
rahat

[IbnMardhiyah]

right, whatever.

So do you still believe that the "overwhelming majority" of discussions on Islamica are all about "ensuring" so-and-so is a kafir?

[Timbit]

Umm... original post was a good reminder.
The ensuing discussion about the Imam was crazy.

[rahat]

Yes I do - altho I admit I might be a bit biased against "threads that piss me off"

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by rahat

Yes I do - altho I admit I might be a bit biased against "threads that piss me off"

Okay well you're wrong.

Neither the "majority" or the "overwhelming majority" of discussions on Islamica have anything to do with takfeer.

Take it easy.

[sixpakistan]

Originally Posted by thejellymill

The problem is jaysh posts these commonly known facts just for kicks because he obviously has nothing else to do (the fact that he's on here almost 24/7 posting a new thread every hour is a good clue). He often responds to those he disagrees with in a disrespectful, sometimes outright rude or even hateful manner and insults other groups. Plus didn't he once declare takfir on shadha or something? Isn't that why he got banned in the first place?

See, the thing is, these aren't necessarily commonly known facts. Refer to my first post in the thread. He didn't declare takfir on shadha, btw.

Originally Posted by thejellymill

If you look back at my original comment in the thread you would see that the point I am trying to make here is that jaysh never gets banned because he's been here longer and is friends with others who have also been around forever, some of whom are now moderators. However, new people that do the same thing as he does (spew bigoted garbage, make needless threads, reply to others with disrespect and declare people kafirs) get banned in a second. [/color]

Jaysh gets banned like every single week. What are you talking about?

[jinnzaman]

Originally Posted by thejellymill

Ah so you read fph eh? At any rate, posting in fph about my new shirt or pimple medicine is safer than posting stuff that puts me at risk for committing a sin by wrongly insulting or offending somebody.

As for posting "evidence" for bigoted remarks, it is obvious enough that I don't need to go search out proof for you. I am not the only one who thinks jaysh's tactics, beliefs and language can be offensive.

Unlike some people, I do not have all day to sit around on islamica and bicker about common sense issues and grammar rules so I must now take my leave. Salaam.

No I don't read FPH, but I've been part of the FPH chats and they're idiotic and talk mostly about make up and biological functions. Its not sinful to critique heretical groups or thoughts and if you think make up is more important than that, subhanaAllah.

Again, if you can't post something specific that indicates bigotry, then perhaps you should retract your statement. If there are SOOO many people who think its bigoted, then how come none of you can point to even a SINGLE sentence that is bigoted?

[zeyneddine]

Originally Posted by jinnzaman

No I don't read FPH, but I've been part of the FPH chats and they're idiotic and talk mostly about make up and biological functions. Its not sinful to critique heretical groups or thoughts and if you think make up is more important than that, subhanaAllah.

Again, if you can't post something specific that indicates bigotry, then perhaps you should retract your statement. If there are SOOO many people who think its bigoted, then how come none of you can point to even a SINGLE sentence that is bigoted?

Does anyone else think this is takfir?

[Rambo]

Originally Posted by rahat

Why do sunni sects focus sooooooooooooooooooo much on declaring other kufr.

this certainly was not the "sunnah" of the Prophet.

its mostly salafis/wahabhis who do that. They want to quickly declare people kufr.

[Revert]

Originally Posted by jinnzaman

Jaysh didn't deal with Rahat the way he did because he's Shia, but because he made a bad argument and made an insinuation that denigrated Sunnism so he reacted appropriately.

What exactly did he say that indicated he thought he was better than the rest of us? Which sentence indicated slyness? I'm curious, becuase I didn't get that vibe at all.

The overall tone indicates the sly attitude. Maybe its just me and Jelly mill that get that vibe.

I know Jaysh didn't deal with Rahat that way because he's shia..he treats most people tha