[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Jaysh

Yeah, so.....?

I just wanted to see where your ethics standards are.

Notwithstanding a recantation, it serves as a baseline against which I compare and contrast your future statements and actions.

That's all.

[MossadConspiracy]

Originally Posted by Jaysh

I just want to clarify: those who commit acts like the neo-khawaarij, then they are dogs of hell-fire, and those who sympathize with them are lovers of the dogs of hell-fire.

you have been measured drawn quarter backed and found terribly terribly wanting

[LEGALEAGLE]

Hamza Yusuf is on record as making some incredible comments in the past...including telling muslims to leave islam if they couldn't keep up with the standards...he phrased it using some nonsense about 'kitchens' etc..

attacking muslims....and then apologising because one of them had appeared to him in a dream...

attacking one group/school of muslims when he was in the presence of a rival group...and so on...

This video on the other hand isn't an example of that

Originally Posted by Abu_Hind

What? Lol...in urdu it's a 'zaay' not "dhaal/zaal". They guy surely doesn't know that there's only one way to say 'namaz' and that is: namaz.

It's not a daal/zaal issue...the guy might just have been tatha / lisping and unable to pronounce his 'zaal's' except as daal's

[Revert]

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE

Hamza Yusuf is on record as making some incredible comments in the past...including telling muslims to leave islam if they couldn't keep up with the standards...he phrased it using some nonsense about 'kitchens' etc..

attacking muslims....and then apologising because one of them had appeared to him in a dream...

attacking one group/school of muslims when he was in the presence of a rival group...and so on...

This video on the other hand isn't an example of that



It's not a daal/zaal issue...the guy might just have been tatha / lisping and unable to pronounce his 'zaal's' except as daal's

Shaykh Hamza has also acknowledged that he has said/done things in the public eye that upon reflection he shouldn't have.

This is why he's one of my favourite speakers.

[Jamroll]

Originally Posted by oFoShOuKnO

I hate clones who try to emphasize political correctness and respell words with an extra bit of mustard(see above).

Reminds of this one guy at my masjid who keeps saying the urdu word "namaaz" as "namauddddhh" in order to emphasize his desi-arab hyper boaterness.

HAHAHAHAHA who the hell says "namaudh"? lol. "namaz" is an Urdu word, there is no arabic equivalent.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Revert

Shaykh Hamza has also acknowledged that he has said/done things in the public eye that upon reflection he shouldn't have.

This is why he's one of my favourite speakers.

Ditto.

All people commit mistakes or forget something, you don't keep grinding an axe because of some mistake they made long ago.

[Revert]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

Ditto.

All people commit mistakes or forget something, you don't keep grinding an axe because of some mistake they made long ago.

Word..

this is the essence of our din.

[AmroodWaala]

Originally Posted by Jaysh

I just want to clarify: those who commit acts like the neo-khawaarij, then they are dogs of hell-fire, and those who sympathize with them are lovers of the dogs of hell-fire.

Some of the qualities/beliefs of Khawaarij:

The Khawaarij say: "The one who commits a major sin is a disbeliever, he will not be forgiven and he will reside in the Hellfire forever." And this is contrary to what is stated in the Qur’aan. The reason for this is because they do not have understanding (of the Religion).

Take note that the cause for their falling into these (false beliefs) was their lack of knowledge. This is because they are a people intense in their worship, prayer, fasting and recitation of the Qur’aan. And they have a strong fervor for the Religion, but they do not have knowledge - and this is the problem.
...

They use as evidence texts from the Qur’aan and the Sunnah concerning the threat for committing sins, but they do not comprehend their meanings. They do not refer them back to the other texts, in which there is found a promise for forgiveness and the acceptance of repentance for those whose sins are less than Shirk. So they accept one part and leave off another part - all of this due to their ignorance.

So having an over-protective love for the Religion and enthusiasm are not sufficient. They must be founded upon knowledge and understanding of Allaah’s Religion. This is so that they can be produced from knowledge and so that they can be put in their proper place.

A Glimpse into the Khawaarij
By Shaikh Saalih Al-Fawzaan

[LEGALEAGLE]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

Ditto.

All people commit mistakes or forget something, you don't keep grinding an axe because of some mistake they made long ago.

how about if the person keeps making mistakes such that at the end of virtually each lecture they have to be reminded that they made an error...is such a person a scholar ? shouldn't they best be silent ?

the mark of a learning let alone scholarship is restraint in speech.

[Revert]

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE

how about if the person keeps making mistakes such that at the end of virtually each lecture they have to be reminded that they made an error...is such a person a scholar ? shouldn't they best be silent ?

the mark of a learning let alone scholarship is restraint in speech.

I've watched a lot of his lectures online and I can only rememebr 2 instances of him being corrected.

I know a LOT of people in various countries who have seen him speak in person and have never said anything like this.

Do you have links I could see?

[oFoShOuKnO]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

HAHAHAHAHA who the hell says "namaudh"? lol. "namaz" is an Urdu word, there is no arabic equivalent.

I demand reps as homage!

In other news F-R-E-E that spells free

Credit Report.com baby!

[Jaysh]

Originally Posted by Abu_Hind

Ibn 'Abbas (ra) argued with many Khawarij and brought them back from error.

Ali (ra) reportedly said that Khawarij are our brothers who have erred.

Bro, even if you consider them dogs of hellfire, you don't have the right attitude. We shouldn't wish bad for anyone but wish Guidance for them.

Thanks for the reminder.

You're right. Jazakh-Allah Khairan.

I appreciate the way you gave naseeha, as opposed to the way Ibn M did.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE

how about if the person keeps making mistakes such that at the end of virtually each lecture they have to be reminded that they made an error...is such a person a scholar ? shouldn't they best be silent ?

the mark of a learning let alone scholarship is restraint in speech.

Was he making the same mistake over and over again after being advised about it? If the advise was about something basic and simple, then its understandable if laymen were the ones advising, but if that wasn't the case, then the question also arises if the advisor was competent and capable of giving such advice.

As for whether Shk. Hamza Yusuf is a scholar or not, there is no question about it whatsoever. I have personally, to myself, disagreed with some things he said [or was have reported to have said] in the past, but that didn't stop me from listening to him, and it certainly never made me doubt or reject his scholarly status.

[Timbit]

Didn't see the original video, but why would anybody dislike Shaykh Hamza?