[AbuAlAbbas]

So Hanbali, if you are against revolt against the leaders, why do you keep bring up al-sahwa like its a good thing? do you see thats its ok to revolt against the saudi government?

[LEGALEAGLE]

Originally Posted by AbuAlAbbas

So Hanbali, if you are against revolt against the leaders, why do you keep bring up al-sahwa like its a good thing? do you see thats its ok to revolt against the saudi government?

Who cares what any of you Saudi's think ?

One day the army of Khurasan is going to come down from the eastern lands of ice near Hind as the Prophet pbuh predicted and wipe out all your arrogance, misguidance...

[AbuAlAbbas]

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE

Who cares what any of you Saudi's think ?

One day the army of Khurasan is going to come down from the eastern lands of ice near Hind as the Prophet pbuh predicted and wipe out all your arrogance, misguidance...

Im not saudi.

And it is apparent that I was right about what you meant with the hadith.

Anyways, you are a fountain of ignorance, and this can be seen in your posts, but now you are a muhadith, subhanAllah this is the essence and basis of ilm al kalam.

Lets see you prove "our misguidance"...go ahead.

[LEGALEAGLE]

Originally Posted by AbuAlAbbas

Im not saudi.

And it is apparent that I was right about what you meant with the hadith.

Anyways, you are a fountain of ignorance, and this can be seen in your posts, but now you are a muhadith, subhanAllah this is the essence and basis of ilm al kalam.

Lets see you prove "our misguidance"...go ahead.

More insults...

Saudi's are all the same...whatever they touch they ruin...there hasn't been a nation or person which has profited from their 'advice'..

Ever since the day when they destroyed the khilaafa they've done nothing but spread fitna..

[AbuAlAbbas]

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE

More insults...

Saudi's are all the same...whatever they touch they ruin...there hasn't been a nation or person which has profited from their 'advice'..

Ever since the day when they destroyed the khilaafa they've done nothing but spread fitna..

again, prove "our misguidance"

[bluey]

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE

More insults...

Saudi's are all the same...whatever they touch they ruin...there hasn't been a nation or person which has profited from their 'advice'..

Ever since the day when they destroyed the khilaafa they've done nothing but spread fitna..

Assalam Aalykum,

With all due respect Legal, I think you're stereotyping the Saudis. [And the Salafis, although I'd like to add contrary to popular belief, not all Saudis are Salafis] Sure they have their problems and issues, but what Country doesn't? Secondly, not one but quite a few Ulema within the Country have spoken out against the Royal Family and its dealings. A lot of the Shyookh have been imprisoned and so have people who have dared to speak out for reform/against the government. While others remain quiet in order to remain out of prison and spread ilm. Sure the Country will have its bad fruits, but grouping them altogether and saying that 'whatever they touch they ruin', simply because they are Saudi borders on being racist. Wa Allahu aa'lam.

[Rambo]

Originally Posted by bluey

Assalam Aalykum,

With all due respect Legal, I think you're stereotyping the Saudis. [And the Salafis, although I'd like to add contrary to everyones belief, not all Saudis are Salafis] Sure they have their problems and issues, but what Country doesn't? Secondly, not one but quite a few Ulema within the Country have spoken out against the Royal Family and its dealings. A lot of the Shyookh have been imprisoned and so have people who have dared to speak out for reform/against the government. While others remain quiet in order to remain out of prison and spread ilm. Sure the Country will have its bad fruits, but grouping them altogether and saying that 'whatever they touch they ruin', simply because they are Saudi borders on being racist. Wa Allahu aa'lam.

Saudi arabia is the homeland of the holy cities thats why its so important the our holy cities should not be under corrupt slaves of the west.

[Abdul_Karim]

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE

Ever since the day when they destroyed the khilaafa they've done nothing but spread fitna..

You're giving the Sa'udis credit for something they had little to do with (although they helped, a teeny bit).

The Sa'udis didn't destroy the khilafah. They staged about three failed rebellions against it in a backwater that nobody cared about (Najd), and occassionally got the upper hand (such as their brief conquest of Makkah) but were always eventually defeated.

The two greater culprits were the "Young Turks" who secularized the government, took the Empire into a suicidal alliance with Germany, and eventually abolished the khilafah, and the Hashimite Ashraf of Makkah, who, with Britain's support, staged the "Arab Revolt" (which the Sa'udis joined, but took very little part in).

You know nothing of history. Go play somewhere.

[Jamroll]

To be honest, we destroyed the Caliphate as an Ummah. Well maybe not us personally, but our forefathers.

[Hanbali]

Originally Posted by AbuAlAbbas

So Hanbali, if you are against revolt against the leaders, why do you keep bring up al-sahwa like its a good thing? do you see thats its ok to revolt against the saudi government?

I am not a member of As-Sahwa.

Having said that, from what I know, As-Sahwa was merely a reform movement, not a revolutionary movement.

As for myself, I take the middle path with the Saudi government, neither taking the position of the SPUBs Murjia nor taking the path of the Takfeeri Al-Qaeda. I advocate reform through naseeha and patient perseverance, not through oppositional defiance.

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE

Who cares what any of you Saudi's think ?

I really have no clue what you mean by "you Saudis"...who in the world are you even talking about?

One day the army of Khurasan is going to come down from the eastern lands of ice near Hind as the Prophet pbuh predicted and wipe out all your arrogance, misguidance...

Brother, your view of Mehdi is very strange and sectarian. You think that the Mehdi will destroy fellow Muslims?? Or will he unite our hearts and ranks? Does it matter where he comes from so long as he does that?

[AbuAlAbbas]

Originally Posted by Hanbali

I advocate reform through naseeha and patient perseverance, not through oppositional defiance.

I Agree, this is the sunnah.

[Rambo]

"I advocate reform through naseeha and patient perseverance, not through oppositional defiance"

Hanabali is any one really doing that? i dont think any scholars are even giving naseeha to saudi government and even if they are, surely it isn't working. Saudis are still the same

[MossadConspiracy]

i fear that alot of ulcers and race wars are going to result from this topic

[LEGALEAGLE]

Originally Posted by Hanbali

Brother, your view of Mehdi is very strange and sectarian. You think that the Mehdi will destroy fellow Muslims?? Or will he unite our hearts and ranks? Does it matter where he comes from so long as he does that?

Hanbali make up your mind.

You label Imam Maturidi ra a heretic because of his aqeedah. That means you've labelled ALL of his followers heretics.

The majority of the people who follow the ulema of Deoband follow Imam Maturidi ra are therefore according to your belief 'heretics'. I follow Imam Maturidi ra's Aqeedah.

So far you haven't labelled Imam Asharii ra a heretic though I believe that is also your belief. Am I right ?

At the same time you call me 'brother'. In what way are we 'brothers' ? With one word you reject the majority of Sunni's as heretics and with another you claim to be one of us ?

Strongly suggest you read

Hujrah.com اسلام حجرة :: View topic - Hazrath Mahdi

[Good_ol_JR]

Originally Posted by Hanbali

Maybe cuz they are?

LOL wtf so now Salafi laymen such as yourselves have the ability to see Imaan along with your ability to declare takfeer. I actually have a lot of respect for various Salafi scholars even though I'm not one personally; but the problem is a lot of their followers are nothing but arrogant attention-whores with absolutely no manners who thrive on conflict. They're the main reason why the Salafi movement will never win the hearts and minds of mainstream Muslims. Regardless of how great some of their leaders may be; no one wants to hold hands with the whores surrounding them.


Remember a couple years back, Sh. Yusuf Estes who I have a lot of respect for made friendly, constructive criticism of one of the practices at the Zaytuna Institute of Hamza Yusuf. The two groups discussed the issue and respectfully agreed to disagree and made amends and it should have ended right there but it didn't because a bunch of Salafi laymen became prostitute cheerleaders and bashed the entire Zaytuna inst. and all associated w/ them. They called for boycotting Zaytuna and Sunnipath events, causing others students to call for the boycotting of Al-Maghrib which was f'd up because there are all great places to learn Islam and the 3 organizations have utmost respect for one another. IA once the attention-whores are eliminated from this Ummah we can finally unite. Until then no matter how great there scholars may be, the ignorant laymen amongst them will always hold the Salafi movement down



It's really kind symbolic to your posts on Islamica, Hanbali; every once in a while you will make a decent, knowledgeable post. However, it is almost always followed up by plenty of emo. rants showcasing your inability to control your anger and exposing you as the attention-***** you are.

In regards to the Shaykh, I will apologize for labeling him with to broad a brush, however as previously mentioned he has been criticized quite a few times by sources such as Islamic Thinkers Society (not that I alway agree with them but they have many valid arguments). Also like all scholars with current links to Saudi he will always be scrutinized. I do not know if it is necessarily justifiable but that is just what happens given Saudis poor reputation

All that aside though, I will apologize for speaking ill of his scholarship or personal aims however, his interpretation of the Khurusan Hadith is a minority opinion; because the majority accept the narration based upon the fact when there are hadith with weak chains but several narrations; the scholars can raise it to a sound Hasan Hadith, which is just under the level of Sahih. And that is why the Khurusan narration is almost unanimously accepted; along with the fact that the Abbasids, who did not even come from Khurusan, tried to exploit the hadith in the first place because so many accepted it as hasan.

Brother, your view of Mehdi is very strange and sectarian. You think that the Mehdi will destroy fellow Muslims?? Or will he unite our hearts and ranks? Does it matter where he comes from so long as he does that?

I do not believe the poster made any such mention of that; it is not possible to be "racist" against Saudis or Arabs because we unanimously accepted that the Mahdi himself will be residing in Medina and that the pious people of Medina will be the first to appoint him and give Bayah to him. That said, the army from Khurusan which actually protects the Mahdi is said to be pre-dominantly non-Arab which makes perfect sense since Arabs are not the majority of this Ummah. But the reasons why many find it tempting to be hostile towards Saudis who reject this hadith is because it's easy to see that they don't want accept a bunch of Rafiqs (slur used against foreigners by Saudis) as the protectors and army of the Mahdi

As for myself, I take the middle path with the Saudi government, neither taking the position of the SPUBs Murjia nor taking the path of the Takfeeri Al-Qaeda.

Sorry but you cannot simply label those who dislike the Saudi regime as being from the imaginary group known as Al-Qaeda; speaking out against an unjust puppet government is not equivalent to declaring global jihad through illegal and unjust means.

I advocate reform through naseeha and patient perseverance, not through oppositional defiance.

That's perfectly fine by me because the Saudis have already shot themselves in the foot and they will get what's coming to them once they run out of oil and are no longer useful to their colonial masters. IMO it is not long till we see an Israeli flag over the Jeddah (though it's already there symbolically) and it shall remain until the Madinah is discovered in Medina and the army from Khurusan arrives.

So there is no reason for us to revolt to see the regime destroyed they're headed there anyways; but don't ever think I will accept it as being a just Islamic society because they're about as close to that as the Red Light District of Amsterdam