[sixpakistan]

Originally Posted by IbnAbdullah

At least they don't do taqiyyah, they are open Kuffar, not Munafiqeen, they don't fool the world that they are Muslims and can be united with us. I may trust them more than to believe what shias say. Some Ahl-al-Kitab have been praised in Quran for they speak the truth, while Munafiqeen have been cursed by Allah..

You're an idiot.

[Salahadeen]

Originally Posted by sixpakistan

You're an idiot.

Brother, he's absolutely right on what you quoted. Ask the same Deobandi scholars you like. But I mean real Deobandis living on the subcontinent, not the ones abroad.

[rahat]

Originally Posted by Salahadeen

Please show me where any "Wahhabi" said this . Please prove your words .

You and your buddies said as much in this same thread. "Id rather be with the Jews than with the Shias"


What the hell do you think that means? You support the deaths of Pals, you support israel.

[Bluestar]

Jews do not equate to Zionists

[sixpakistan]

Originally Posted by Salahadeen

Brother, he's absolutely right on what you quoted. Ask the same Deobandi scholars you like. But I mean real Deobandis living on the subcontinent, not the ones abroad.

This is in the context of a discussion about Israel.

[Revert]

Originally Posted by Bluestar

Jews do not equate to Zionists

The vast majority of Jews support Israel. Theres only that one site Jews against Zionism, its fringe minority as far as i am aware.

[Variable]

Originally Posted by Revert

The vast majority of Jews support Israel. Theres only that one site Jews against Zionism, its fringe minority as far as i am aware.

The question is now, does support for Israel equate to Zionism? To me, supporting Israel today doesn't equal zionism, - supporting settlers and those who want to see expansion into 'greater Israel' do.

[Revert]

Originally Posted by Variable

The question is now, does support for Israel equate to Zionism? To me, supporting Israel today doesn't equal zionism, - supporting settlers and those who want to see expansion into 'greater Israel' do.

I beleive it does. Thats what Zionism is, its support for the Jewish Homeland.

[Variable]

Originally Posted by Revert

I beleive it does. Thats what Zionism is, its support for the Jewish Homeland.

I suppose... but if support for Israel's right to exist today makes one a Zionist, then count me in too. At round table discussions and in seminars though, it would seem to me that the word 'zionist' tends to refer to those who have expansionary goals from the current status quo.

[sixpakistan]

Originally Posted by Variable

I suppose... but if support for Israel's right to exist today makes one a Zionist, then count me in too. At round table discussions and in seminars though, it would seem to me that the word 'zionist' tends to refer to those who have expansionary goals from the current status quo.

By the definition of most, it also includes those who are against a return to the '67 borders

[Variable]

Originally Posted by sixpakistan

By the definition of most, it also includes those who are against a return to the '67 borders

Put concisely.

[Revert]

Originally Posted by Variable

I suppose... but if support for Israel's right to exist today makes one a Zionist, then count me in too. At round table discussions and in seminars though, it would seem to me that the word 'zionist' tends to refer to those who have expansionary goals from the current status quo.

Its more complex than how I put it. I tried to simplify the definition of a Zionist, but I think i OVER simplified it. Its one of those topics that really does need to be discussed in depth.

Originally Posted by sixpakistan

By the definition of most, it also includes those who are against a return to the '67 borders

This is also true, like i said its not a term that can be defined simply, not by me anyway.

[Jamroll]

Originally Posted by sixpakistan

By the definition of most, it also includes those who are against a return to the '67 borders

Good point. I think we have to be pragmatic about this situation though. No doubt, most Muslims around the world, in an ideal world would like to see Israel and the Occupied Territories being reconstituted into a state called Palestine, where Jews and Christians have a right to live and work, with freedom to worship, but where Muslims have the power in society that reflects their makeup of the population. For true supporters of democracy, this show also be a natural follow through, since the structure of society should be based on the makeup of the population with guaranteed protection for minorities.

But taking a more pragmatic approach, a return to at least the '67 borders, is a basic foundation on which to conduct future negotiations towards a peaceful settlement of the conflict.

[MossadConspiracy]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

Good point. I think we have to be pragmatic about this situation though. No doubt, most Muslims around the world, in an ideal world would like to see Israel and the Occupied Territories being reconstituted into a state called Palestine, where Jews and Christians have a right to live and work, with freedom to worship, but where Muslims have the power in society that reflects their makeup of the population. For true supporters of democracy, this show also be a natural follow through, since the structure of society should be based on the makeup of the population with guaranteed protection for minorities.

salam

I disagree with you about this being the preferred outcome amongst most muslims around the world. Actually, i have never heard it from muslims in a muslim country, only from ones in the West who have been influenced by left wing movements in America and Israel

The Palestinians are divided when it comes to the way they wish to proceed with the future of their struggle. One view is that Palestine needs to be established in the West Bank and Gaza with Jerusalem as its capital, recognizing Israel's existence and so on. According to alot of polls this is the majority view among Palestinians, although the media images coming from there tend to distort things and make it appear otherwise. The other view is that Palestine needs to be created through the destruction of Israel, the return of the Palestinian refugees, and the expulsion of foreign zionist jews back to Poland, germany, and and wherever else they came from. This is the view that the Nasserites and the socialist resistance movements in the 60s and 70s and it is the current position of the Islamic radicals that are currently carrying the fight that those guys gave up

None of the major Palestinian factions within Palestine or Israel are supporters of the idea that you described, only some Israeli-Arab intellectuals within Israel and Palestinian intellectuals in the diaspora. However, the Israeli Arab parties and politicians within Israeli parties are supporters of the two state solutions

Muslims in muslim countries outside of Palestine (whose opinions really dont matter in the end) are pretty much in agreement that the ideal outcome would be the destruction of Israel and its replacement by an Arab Palestine. This is how it has always been since the founding of Israel. It will take many decades of peace for it to change.

ws

[Bluestar]

A discussion on Muslim Unity and Palestine comes to be debated. How ironic.

Palestine Zindabad.