Sufi / Salafi?

[zzze]

Asslamau alaykum

I think we should leave the debates out of sufi circle/ tassawuf thread and bring them here insha Allah. No copy and paste buisness please

For those who lean the sufi/salafi way...what attracts you to it and why do you oppose the other? What really enhances ur belief that what you're following is the correct way?

jazakallahkhair

[bluey]

Assalam Alaykum,

I usually don't get into the Sufi/Salafi discussions on Islamica or other places because they simply are not worth it. Somehow or the other they always turn into a argument which equals fitna.

But just for the record, if you follow one thing, does not necessarily mean that you reject the other entirely. And Allah subhanna wa ta'ala knows best.

[Unity]

Yea, i've noticed that ppl really get freaky and start e-yelling at others lol. Also, i dont think one has to choose one teaching of Islam. For example, I am a Muslim who has taken all the teachings that will help me get closer to Allah swt. Sooo...i guess i would simply call myself a Muslim and not a Sunni or a Sufi or a Shia or a Salafi. Hope you catch my drift

[Revert]

bluey said

Assalam Alaykum,

I usually don't get into the Sufi/Salafi discussions on Islamica or other places because they simply are not worth it. Somehow or the other they always turn into a argument which equals fitna.

But just for the record, if you follow one thing, does not necessarily mean that you reject the other entirely. And Allah subhanna wa ta'ala knows best.

Exactly...great point Bluey..

I aim to practice tasawwuf in my quest to live a daily Jihad an-nafs, however that doesn't mean I fully reject what people consider the "salafi" way.

[sixpakistan]

Salafiyyah is often represented as Islam stripped to its core components.

I feel that Salafiyyah is Islam stripped of its core components.

Hence, my leanings..

[sak01]

sixpakistan said

Salafiyyah is often represented as Islam stripped to its core components.

I feel that Salafiyyah is Islam stripped of its core components.

Hence, my leanings..

Harsh but true.

Way to pick a fight though...

[ShamilB]

sixpakistan said

Salafiyyah is often represented as Islam stripped to its core components.

I feel that Salafiyyah is Islam stripped of its core components.

Hence, my leanings..

Salafiyya for me is all about following the Quran and Sunnah (if this is what you mean by "core components") and staying away from innovations. Hence why I find the "Salafi" way so appealing. If you think Salafiyya is devoid of self purification or dhikr, then you are clearly mistaken. To me Salafiyya is the sanctioned or halal way of purifying your souls and remembering Allah (swt) - the way the Prophet (saw), the Sahaba and the early generation of Muslims performed self-purification.

[Jamroll]

Salam,

I think there's good and beneficial things in both Sufi and Salafi circles. The problem arises from the reaction both groups get from each other, which can lead them to be come extreme in relation to one another.

Also, how we define these terms can lead to totally different interpretations of what it means to be a "sufi" or a "salafi".

Some "sufi" practices are deviant and even contain elements of shirk, and give real Sufis who adhere to the tenets of the Sharia a bad name. On the other hand, sufis in their real sense are those who practice tawassuf, concentrating on self-purification and developing a closer relationship with the Almighty.

Some "salafis" can seem to be rigid and wooden in their application, and give more importance to a unflinchingly literalist interpretation of everything. On the other hand, they strive hard to root out wrong, innovated ideas, and to return to the sources of Islam, the Qur'an and Sunnah.

However, personally I feel that there is a middle path between these two ends of the Islamic spectrum, which incorporates both tawassuf and self-purification, with the fundamental "rope of Allah", the Qur'an and Sunnah, and this is why I tend to find most favour with the idea of adhering to the madhab system, which has rich, deep and established roots in both these areas.

[Revert]

Jamroll said

Salam,

I think there's good and beneficial things in both Sufi and Salafi circles. The problem arises from the reaction both groups get from each other, which can lead them to be come extreme in relation to one another.

Also, how we define these terms can lead to totally different interpretations of what it means to be a "sufi" or a "salafi".

Some "sufi" practices are deviant and even contain elements of shirk, and give real Sufis who adhere to the tenets of the Sharia a bad name. On the other hand, sufis in their real sense are those who practice tawassuf, concentrating on self-purification and developing a closer relationship with the Almighty.

Some "salafis" can seem to be rigid and wooden in their application, and give more importance to a unflinchingly literalist interpretation of everything. On the other hand, they strive hard to root out wrong, innovated ideas, and to return to the sources of Islam, the Qur'an and Sunnah.

However, personally I feel that there is a middle path between these two ends of the Islamic spectrum, which incorporates both tawassuf and self-purification, with the fundamental "rope of Allah", the Qur'an and Sunnah, and this is why I tend to find most favour with the idea of adhering to the madhab system, which has rich, deep and established roots in both these areas.

Nice post...very well put..

[zzze]

assalamu alaykum

jazakallahkhair to everyone who replied

sixpakistan said

Salafiyyah is often represented as Islam stripped to its core components.

I feel that Salafiyyah is Islam stripped of its core components.

Hence, my leanings..

wow, ok...what about those who don't define ''salafiyyah'' in the same way that you do...those who incorporate dhikr etc into their lives...what makes that different from your ''leaning''?

ShamilB said

Salafiyya for me is all about following the Quran and Sunnah (if this is what you mean by "core components") and staying away from innovations. Hence why I find the "Salafi" way so appealing. If you think Salafiyya is devoid of self purification or dhikr, then you are clearly mistaken. To me Salafiyya is the sanctioned or halal way of purifying your souls and remembering Allah (swt) - the way the Prophet (saw), the Sahaba and the early generation of Muslims performed self-purification.

I guess my concern is that most of the mosques that I've been to that label themselves as ''salafi'' are all about what to avoid, with ''Do not deviat!!!'' being the main khutbah...but what you define salafiyya to be is very different from what I've come across alhamdulilah.

Jamroll said

Salam,

I think there's good and beneficial things in both Sufi and Salafi circles. The problem arises from the reaction both groups get from each other, which can lead them to be come extreme in relation to one another.

Also, how we define these terms can lead to totally different interpretations of what it means to be a "sufi" or a "salafi".

Some "sufi" practices are deviant and even contain elements of shirk, and give real Sufis who adhere to the tenets of the Sharia a bad name. On the other hand, sufis in their real sense are those who practice tawassuf, concentrating on self-purification and developing a closer relationship with the Almighty.

Some "salafis" can seem to be rigid and wooden in their application, and give more importance to a unflinchingly literalist interpretation of everything. On the other hand, they strive hard to root out wrong, innovated ideas, and to return to the sources of Islam, the Qur'an and Sunnah.

However, personally I feel that there is a middle path between these two ends of the Islamic spectrum, which incorporates both tawassuf and self-purification, with the fundamental "rope of Allah", the Qur'an and Sunnah, and this is why I tend to find most favour with the idea of adhering to the madhab system, which has rich, deep and established roots in both these areas.

ah, the middle way! the radical middle way (habib ali/umar etc)

Now the moderate paths in both ways seem to be the same, I'm no longer able to tell the difference between the two. However, I'm yet to meet a ''salafi'' who actually incorporates self purifcation into their daily lives, whereas I've met so many people who wouldn't class themselves as sufis (as they deem themselves unworthy) strongly stick to the Qur'an and Sunnah AND seek to purify themselves, so what would they be called, sufi or salafi?

I think that sounds like the right balance.

[ShamilB]

zzze said

I guess my concern is that most of the mosques that I've been to that label themselves as ''salafi'' are all about what to avoid, with ''Do not deviat!!!'' being the main khutbah...but what you define salafiyya to be is very different from what I've come across alhamdulilah.

Self-purification can be achieved in many ways - praying sunnah or nafl prayers, reciting the Quran, praying qiyaam-ul layl, fasting on mondays and thursdays and many other acts of sunnah - these are all means of self purification.

[zzze]

assalamu alaykum

true, tho interesting how the acts of ibaada you mentioned are all external

[ShamilB]

zzze said

assalamu alaykum

true, tho interesting how the acts of ibaada you mentioned are all external

The concept of dhikr is not alien to the Salafis - this is a common misconception that many people have. The prophet (saw) himself did dhikr after Salat, during Ramadan, during the night. What is uncommon is the idea of a communal dhikr session where you are told to recite Allah's name a specified number of times, and if you do you get rewarded with a certain blessing. There are many many other examples but you get the drift.

[zzze]

asslamau alaykum

uncommon in what, with who? The recitation of Allah swt's names isn't just for communal practice.

[Abdul_Karim]

zzze said

assalamu alaykum

true, tho interesting how the acts of ibaada you mentioned are all external

All the things that Sufis do (sama, hadhrah, khalwah, the various awrad recited by mureeds) are external acts as well, with the exception of the Naqshabandi silent dhikr. I think it's funny how the Sufis act like they're all about the inner workings of the heart, when they are as focused on external ritual as the Salafis.