[sixpakistan]

Originally Posted by Revert

Thanks for the heads up on the masjid situation. I have no problems with doing soojood on the turbah as long as its for the intentions you and others have described.

The OP is just out to make a noise and project his own views on everyone else. I do believe he feels he is doing the right thing so please don't judge him too harshly.

The problem is that the OP isn't that he's just a kid with mediocre reasoning ability, which he is. It's that he fails entirely at being aware of himself and recognizing this fact.

And so he sees nothing wrong with thinking that he has a magical new end-all, be-all solution.. a solution which not only defies 1400 years of scholarship by men whose chappals he isn't fit to clean, it defies simple logic. And worse, he sees nothing wrong with attempting to influence others with this filth and heresy.

[AliMuzzafarDaima]

Hi, Salams

I suggest anyone interested in opening their minds up a bit more to the different beliefs in Islam today read the great book my Reza Aslan "No god but God", especially the chapter beginning on page 108. It really shed a lot of light on the differences between Sunni-Shia things for my simple mind.

[Zam]

Originally Posted by AceOfHearts

I left the God-like glorification and praise of the Prophet Muhammad in my Salah in favour of glorifying Allah alone in my Salah. As I came from a Sunni family, glorifying the Prophet up to 20 times a day in Salah was not uncommon. Remembering Allah alone was impossible without remembering a created being, every Salah a good portion was devoted to the Prophet Muhammad.

Now I find Shia's who have made stones intercessors with Allah. Is there any limit to how much idolatry people can commit on earth?

What part of the heavens and the earth did this stone create that you make it a requirement to prostrate on it?

Why will none of you people glorify Allah alone, the most majestic...who sustains you and given you so much?

"Allah sends His Salah on the Prophet (Muhammad), and also His angels (do so). Oh you who believe! Send your Salah on (i.e. ask Allah to bless) him (Muhammad) and greet him with the Islamic way of greeting (i.e. as-Salaam Alaykum, which means peace be upon you)" (33:56)

[Jetmir]

Its praying for the prophet salallahu alayhi was sallam, not to the prophet. you genius. pretty soon u'll be taking out verses from the Qur'an which can't be from God, or do not apply to us....that's how shaytan works.

[bihari]

Originally Posted by psychoteddybear

Yeah I kinda always wondered about that...when I first started praying, I went to a Shi'a mosque..not knowing what it was about...and these women put these stones in front of me...I kinda pushed it to the side and one of them was like uh no you need that in front of you to pray! and I was like uh wutever...but not to piss them off, I did...then tailgated it out of there. This was in Canada btw...

Anyways, I guess I've heard that these stones are from some holy place...Karbala maybe..where the Prophet's grandson Hussein was killed and supposedly his blood was staining the earth and these are why these rocks are holy ...cuz they come from this area...uh...correct me if you like...but I hear a lot of crap that's supposed to be Islamic anyways...

wa salam

i heard they come from Najaf

but most shia dont do this...i have some far relatives who are shia and they pray with us and dont use these stones

[slime]

so THAT'S what those are for.
whew. k cuz one time i was at a shia mosque in detroit and it was really dark and i tripped over someone's rock and i got soooo scared. i ran out of the hall.

[Rida]

Originally Posted by bihari

i heard they come from Najaf

but most shia dont do this...i have some far relatives who are shia and they pray with us and dont use these stones

It's wajib to pray on something natural for the ithna asheriyya's if im not mistaken. Leaving it invalidates your prayer.
Maybe its different for ismaili's or zaydi's?

[bihari]

Originally Posted by Rida

It's wajib to pray on something natural for the ithna asheriyya's if im not mistaken. Leaving it is invalidates your prayer.
Maybe its different for ismaili's or zaydi's?

idk...bec the people i was refering to are itha ashri also..but dont pray with these stones

ill check though

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Rida

It's wajib to pray on something natural for the ithna asheriyya's if im not mistaken. Leaving it is invalidates your prayer.
Maybe its different for ismaili's or zaydi's?

I've prayed with Zaydi's before, and they don't use a turbah.

[Kadhim]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

I've prayed with Zaydi's before, and they don't use a turbah.

Do they use a prayer mat of straw or other such natural materials?

[chubbychubbymango]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the confusion seems to be praying with the stone in FRONT of you vs resting your head on it during sujood. The topic starter seems to be under the impression of the former. They don't do that.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Kadhim

Do they use a prayer mat of straw or other such natural materials?

This was in Yemen, in Sanaa' - and no, at all their masaajid that i went to ... just like all the other masaajid all around the world just like everyone else they were praying on carpet.

[Revert]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

This was in Yemen, in Sanaa' - and no, at all their masaajid that i went to ... just like all the other masaajid all around the world just like everyone else they were praying on carpet.

Was the carpet made from synthetic or natural materials?

[Biryani]

I haven't actually read the whole post,so some of what I say may be a repeat.

As a Shia, I'm more offended by the rediculous comments made about remembering the Prophet (pbuh) than about praying on a stone. The latter is simply a matter of fiqhi difference. There's hundreds of them. Nothing to get worked up about (unless of course you know little or nothing about fiqh)

As per the irresponsible statements made by the brother about the Prophet (pbuh) and removing him from his life to remember God alone. Perhaps you are forgetting thatt he Quran too insists on reminding us about the Prophets (pbuh). If all Allah (swt) wanted was for us to remember him, why didn't he just make the Quran one big book about him. Yet we see he tells us stories of Prophets (pbuh) and messengers throughout. After removing the Prophet (pbuh) from your life and salaat, will you alter the Quran next?

He was the teacher, the muallim, who taught us to know Allah (swt). If you rented a house and agreed to pay a monthly rent and later went back on your word. You may have done nothing but prayed and remembered God while you were at the house, but when you show up on the day of judgement you will have nothing to show because all your good deeds will be void because you did not pray the ajr that was to be paid to the landlord. If you do not give ajr to the muallim from whom you have gained the knowledge, then it is not your knowledge, it is usurped knowledge. You may spend your life praying, fasting, doing hajj, etc but all will be with no purpose unless you give Muhammad (pbuh) the ajar he deserves.

Shaitan made the same mistake. He spent years praying to Allah (swt) and when Allah (swt) asked him for one thing, he placed his own ego of interpretation than that of Allah (swt) and all of the prayers were rejected. His refusal to bow before the Prophet (pbuh) lead to his falll.

Surah 33:Verse 56:
إِنَّ اللَّهَ وَمَلَائِكَتَهُ يُصَلُّونَ عَلَى النَّبِيِّ يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا صَلُّوا عَلَيْهِ وَسَلِّمُوا تَسْلِيمًا {
[Yusufali 33:56] Allah and His angels send blessings on the Prophet: O ye that believe! Send ye blessings on him, and salute him with all respect.

The tense is imperitive and it is for those who believe. It is the Sunnat of Allah to send blessings and salute the Prophet (pbuh) with respect. While it is not my place to declare people as disbelievers, this verse seems to imply that not sending blessings upon the Prophet (pbuh) is a clear decleration of disbelief or worse decleration that I am a believer but I still do not follow the commands of Allah (swt). (IE a Kafir).

As for the comments about praying on a stone. I don't think anyone takes the stone to be an idol or an intercessor. I have heard that praying salaat at a masjid will earn you more reward than praying at your home. I have heard that even more sawab if it is the greatest masjid Masjid e Nabawi. If I was to take the dirt of that masjid and bring it home to me so that I may pray on the dirt of that masjid even while I am thousands of miles away, then I would find satisfaction in that.

Shia fiqh considers it mandatory to pray on something natural, perferably not man made. The Prophet (pbuh) never prayed on a synthetic prayer rug. Maybe a prayer mat (the kind made of straw which shias consider it permissible to pray on directly). The most natural thing is dirt to remind us that we have come from dirt and to it we shall return.

Of course if the dirt is from a place so holy that the Imams, Prophets and their closest companions and family members walked, than for me that dirt would be preferable to the dirt found in my backyard.

You don't have to pray like that because your fiqh doesnt mandate it.

Bir