[roberto]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

Because...?

You live in one of the best and oldest Western democracies and you know that's it's not an example of democracy and that includes the USA and other members of the coalition.

The surprise is because you generally do not sink to such unjustifiable attacks.

[roberto]

Originally Posted by bluey

Thats the same excuse they gave for the Abu Ghraib prison scandal. '''Oh, not everyone is like that.'' I might agree to the fact that not every single person in the U.S Army is a cold-blooded murderer [But hey - even that is arguable], but there are a large number of people in the U.S Army who've commited atrocities against innocent civilians in both Iraq and Afghanistan.

Are we forgetting the rape of Abeer Qassim Hamza? Or the death of her family, including a five year old? Are we forgetting what happened in Fallujah? Hundreds of innocent people were shot dead on sight. Including children, Women and innocent Men. Infact it was reported that they used napalm bombs on Fallujah - the same ones which were used in Vietnam which burn the flesh off people. Or the massacre in the village of Haditha? And those are only a few that come to light, Iraqi and Afghani civilians die nearly everyday at the hands of American Soldiers.

Maybe you should watch this:

How your American soldiers bomb people who are running and then say, 'Oh dude'.

YouTube - American War Crimes

YouTube - USA Crimes: Iraq War Casualties

May Allah subhanna wa ta'ala punish them for what they do to innocent people and never give them peace in this dunya. Ameen.

So once again you trawl the net to feed your hatred, once again you generalise, once again you label all American as murders and uncaring killers as if they are a special breed, evolved specifically to kill Muslims, do you really think anyone with an ounce of sense takes your postings seriously, if you do your sadly deluded

[Jamroll]

Originally Posted by roberto

You live in one of the best and oldest Western democracies and you know that's it's not an example of democracy and that includes the USA and other members of the coalition.

The surprise is because you generally do not sink to such unjustifiable attacks.

Right. So we know it's not an example of freedom and democracy. Which means Bush and his cronies claims to be delivering this to the Iraqi people is false. Which means that the reasons for going to war and continuing to stay there are nothing to do with freedom, democracy or the Iraqi people. Perhaps certain people, such as yourself, would do well to think about that, and stop cheerleading it as if there's some kind of altruistic aspect to our "mission" there.

[Jamroll]

Originally Posted by Kona_Silat

There are thousands of soliders and you let 1 idiot to reflect the rest? How ironic of Muslims

It's easy to get selective memory about the atrocities carried out by US soldiers, but I think there's more than one. There's several. There's many.

[roberto]

[quote=Jamroll;12685]

Right. So we know it's not an example of freedom and democracy.

If I assume this a sincere remark, then thanks for acknowledging the error of your statement that "it was"

Which means Bush and his cronies claims to be delivering this to the Iraqi people is false. Which means that the reasons for going to war and continuing to stay there are nothing to do with freedom, democracy or the Iraqi people.

This is a muddle statement and logically in error, however dealing with this "the reason for attacking Iraq was not to bring freedom to the people" I like many others considered the situation in Iraq under the dictatorship of Saddam was horrendous, however there were/are many other dictatorships just a bad, hence the justification presented to the British people was the threat of WMD, this was shown to be incorrect and probably a deliberate lie.The reason was as I see it, regime change not just because it was bad, but order to preserve influence in the oil rich Middle East. The attack was wrong, the planning to deal with events after the end of conflict was non - existent and the situation is a terrible mess for which the West is largely responsible.

The reason I say largely is because some of the blame for current killing can be attributed to warring religious factions and outside interference, one cannot claim that these people have no choice they have.

Perhaps certain people, such as yourself, would do well to think about that, and stop cheerleading it as if there's some kind of altruistic aspect to our "mission" there

I fail to understand, how you can justification for this accusation, perhaps you would care to either withdraw it, or explain

[Foxhole]

Originally Posted by shadha

AstaghfiruAllah.

Whether it's Muslims cheering or non-Muslims cheering, it is still disgusting and despicable and inhumane. I can't begin to fathom how one can cheer like that over a death of another.


shadha-

Such as crying "Allahu Akbar" when a roadside bomb is set off?

[Foxhole]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

It's easy to get selective memory about the atrocities carried out by US soldiers, but I think there's more than one. There's several. There's many.

If it's atrocities you care about, why focus on the small number carried out by the US?

Do you want a list of al Qaeda's mass murder bombings of markets, villages, mosques, religious processions, and other places where people with no weapons congregate?

The reason is that you don't care about atrocities. You care about which side wins, however dirty and dishonorable the means.

[Kumo]

bush is a terrorist.

[bluey]

Originally Posted by roberto

So once again you trawl the net to feed your hatred, once again you generalise, once again you label all American as murders and uncaring killers as if they are a special breed, evolved specifically to kill Muslims, do you really think anyone with an ounce of sense takes your postings seriously, if you do your sadly deluded

I didn't 'trawl' the net, these were facts and actual cases that happened in Iraq and hundreds more that go unreported. And when did I generalise? Do you find anywhere in my posts that I've said that 'All Americans are murderers and uncaring Killers'? No. I've said that yes, that a lot of American Soldiers and the allies in Iraq have committed a lot of atrocities in Iraq and this is a fact. Infact, a lot of Iraqis say that they were better off with Saddam Hussein because things were better underneath him. An estimate of 100,000 Iraqis have died since the illegitimate occupation of Iraq by the United States. [Some reports say that it has gone to 650,000].

Oh, look who is talking, do you think anyone takes your posts seriously?

[roberto]

[quote=bluey;13048]

I didn't 'trawl' the net, these were facts and actual cases that happened in Iraq and hundreds more that go unreported.

So you didn't get these hundred of cases from the net, then where did you get them, after all you also say they were not reported; go on tell me you vist Iraq on a regular basis, yeah sure you do.

And when did I generalise? Do you find anywhere in my posts that I've said that 'All Americans are murderers and uncaring Killers'?

Well take a look at this comments of yours:

'''Oh, not everyone is like that.'' I might agree to the fact that not every single person in the U.S Army is a cold-blooded murderer [But hey - even that is arguable], but there are a large number of people in the U.S Army who've commited atrocities against innocent civilians in both Iraq and Afghanistan."

Well even on this post alone the above is near enought for me

And this comment:
"No. I've said that yes, that a lot of American Soldiers and the allies in Iraq have committed a lot of atrocities in Iraq and this is a fact. Infact, a lot of Iraqis say that they were better off with Saddam Hussein because things were better underneath him. An estimate of 100,000 Iraqis have died since the illegitimate occupation of Iraq by the United States. [Some reports say that it has gone to 650,000]. "

And for the last year most have been killed by other Iraqis or Muslim insurgence

Oh, look who is talking, do you think anyone takes your posts seriously?

Well your need to use childish input such as roll-eyes clearly indicates your lack of maturity

Carry on enjoy your hatred

[ModerateGuy]

Those poor people....war is supposed to be a last defensive resort. I'm an American and generally proud of it...but George Bush is a stupid, uncaring bastard...and I'm ashamed that he is also an American.

Damn him and his cronies for doing this. For lying to the American people about the reasons for going to war, for his international policies, everything....

YOU ARE FEEDING THEIR HATRED OF US GEORGE!!!! YOU ARE GIVING THEM LEGITIMATE REASONS TO HATE US YOU STUPID SOB.

We cannot let this continue. Let the half of America who voted for Bush wake up and realize what he has done to our country and to the people of other nations.