[ChotooMotoo]

Originally Posted by Aryan_

Nothing new about this allegation, the jews have been pushing it for as long as Christians have been around. The more familiar version was that Mary was a ***** and the Roman soldier one of her clients.

When I'm rich enough I'll make my own film about Jewish blood rituals.

back on topic....

[AmroodWaala]

Originally Posted by ChotooMotoo

Piano, Voice, Trombone.

nice

Originally Posted by ChotooMotoo

back on topic....

[Variable]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

You never cease to amaze me dude.

That kind of "hypothesis" [that Prophet Jesus may have been a product of rape] is offensive to Muslims and Christians on two counts:

a) Everyone knows Jesus' conception was immaculate.
b) That the Virgin Mary was one of the most, if not the most chaste woman, to have ever lived.

All these years you've spent around Muslims and Christians didn't clue you into that? Or were you just playing dumb again?

Glad you think I'm so amazing.

But here's a revolutionary new idea for you: People believe have different beliefs...

In fact not everyone 'knows' that Jesus' birth mother was a virgin... it's a belief held by two religions. Other people have other ideas, and they're free to express them like Muslims are theirs and Christians are theirs.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Variable

Glad you think I'm so amazing.

But here's a revolutionary new idea for you: People believe have different beliefs...

In fact not everyone 'knows' that Jesus' birth mother was a virgin... it's a belief held by two religions. Other people have other ideas, and they're free to express them like Muslims are theirs and Christians are theirs.

..... right.

That's like saying "okay yeah everyone knows 1 + 1 = 2 .... but, some other people have different beliefs and they think 1 + 1 = 792."

[Variable]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

..... right.

That's like saying "okay yeah everyone knows 1 + 1 = 2 .... but, some other people have different beliefs and they think 1 + 1 = 792."

What the hell are you talking about? Jesus being born to a virgin mother isn't something as obvious as 1+1=2. It's a religious belief based on faith. Not, fact, not some obvious self-evident truth... but faith. I thought you said you were some kind of genius in that other thread... how can such simple things escape you.

[AmroodWaala]

People who don't believe in spirits, miracles, etc. will try to explain it in physical terms - supported by science.


So, I've heard several reasons as well. It is expected

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Variable

What the hell are you talking about? Jesus being born to a virgin mother isn't something as obvious as 1+1=2. It's a religious belief based on faith. Not, fact, not some obvious self-evident truth... but faith. I thought you said you were some kind of genius in that other thread... how can such simple things escape you.

It becomes obvious and universally accepted when God says it was so, just as much as its universally accepted that 1 + 1 = 2.

If you want to play with words and semantics in order to justify the perverse and erroneous beliefs of others, sure you can claim that as your right.

[Haramoobobi]

I am waiting for the day I see "Dutch filmmaker..." and something not offensive associated to established religion with it. Anyone knowing how the conservatives of the country are dealing with this?

[Pushpa]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

It becomes obvious and universally accepted when God says it was so, just as much as its universally accepted that 1 + 1 = 2.

If you want to play with words and semantics in order to justify the perverse and erroneous beliefs of others, sure you can claim that as your right.

That only works if you believe in God in the first place.

[roberto]

Originally Posted by Pushpa

That only works if you believe in God in the first place.

And indeed even then unless God speaks to you direct, do you believe that the other guy has got it right

[rawrr]

Originally Posted by Haramoobobi

Anyone knowing how the conservatives of the country are dealing with this?

They might be busy sending those spam petition emails for everyone to sign against the existence of this dutch guy. Just an idea...

[Variable]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

It becomes obvious and universally accepted when God says it was so, just as much as its universally accepted that 1 + 1 = 2.

If you want to play with words and semantics in order to justify the perverse and erroneous beliefs of others, sure you can claim that as your right.

There's no semantics or wordplay involved. An equation is a demonstrable fact - the belief that Jesus, or Isa, is who Islam or Christianity says he is - is not. It's a belief based on faith - an assumption that the Bible or the Prophet's words are the unadultered word of God.

Why you choose to make that assumption isn't a big deal to me. But when you accuse others of being perverse or stupid for having their own beliefs - with exactly as much validity as yours - it's a small example of why the world's in such a crap state as it is.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Variable

There's no semantics or wordplay involved. An equation is a demonstrable fact - the belief that Jesus, or Isa, is who Islam or Christianity says he is - is not. It's a belief based on faith - an assumption that the Bible or the Prophet's words are the unadultered word of God..

Can you prove without a doubt that the Qur'an is not the unadulterated word of God?

You trying to cast doubt on that fact is like saying any person, no matter how trustworthy and reliable, has no indisputable claim or fact to state. You might as well stop accepting any book of history as fact because regardless of what it says, its just the "belief" of some people.

[Variable]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

Can you prove without a doubt that the Qur'an is not the unadulterated word of God?

You trying to cast doubt on that fact is like saying any person, no matter how trustworthy and reliable, has no indisputable claim or fact to state. You might as well stop accepting any book of history as fact because regardless of what it says, its just the "belief" of some people.

No it's not at all like that. 1+1=2 is a fact someone can demonstrate right now, and use to accurately predict other things. Academic history is written based on written sources backed by archaeological evidence and carries with it the underlying acknowledgement that it may be proven wrong at any time by new and more reliable evidence.

Religious texts are neither of those things.

And no I can't without a doubt prove that the Quran isn't the word of God... can you prove that Jesus wasn't born as a product of a rape?

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Variable

... can you prove that Jesus wasn't born as a product of a rape?

Yes.

But not to you of course.