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Old 10-25-2007, 10:15 AM
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Post Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

A new translation of the Koran has set an American Muslim woman on a potentially dangerous collision course with fundamentalists.

Laleh Bakhtiar aims to reignite one of the most divisive debates in Islam by rejecting the idea that chapter 4, verse 34 of the Koran grants a husband the divine right to beat his wife.

Physical punishment is held widely to be an acceptable last resort in cases of disobedience after admonition and banishment from the marital bed. Dr Bakhtiar, 68, told The Times that anyone adhering to this interpretation of the verse had denigrated Islam.

Calls for the modernisation of Islam have led to women such as Taslima Nasrin, the Bangladeshi author, and Ayaan Hirsi Ali, the former Dutch MP, facing death threats.

The family of Dr Bakhtiar is fearful for her safety but the academic, based in Chicago, believes that it is God’s will to decide whether she will be vilified.

Imams on Arab television stations discuss frequently what one Qatari preacher called a “wondrous verse” and have even given details of rules for wife-beating. In Germany, the verse was cited by a judge as the reason that he refused a fast-track divorce to a Moroccan woman who was seeking to escape a violent marriage.

Dr Bakhtiar, who has written books on Islamic unity and translated 30 books on Islam and Islamic beliefs into English, says that the Koran does not convey a right to beat women. She has courted further controversy by removing the word “infidel” from her translation and by using “God” instead of “Allah”.

In addition to being American and female, Dr Bakhtiar, 68, is a convert from Christianity and is not a classically trained Arabic scholar. Her translation, The Sublime Quran, took seven years to complete and is not published until April 10, but the bloggers and chat rooms are active already.

She has been accused of having a predetermined agenda, and of not being qualified to translate the Koran. “I have been blessed to be able to complete this work but I have no idea what will happen now,” Dr Bakhtiar said. “My daughter is concerned, but I will deal with it when it comes.”

The key to the verse is the word “daraba” which, Dr Bakhtiar says, has 25 meanings in Arabic and has been variously translated as hit, strike, scourge, chastise, pet, tap and spank. The most common translation, however, is beat.

Dr Bakhtiar insisted that the correct meaning is to “go away from”. She said: “I’m trying to have Islam better understood — God knows if I’ll succeed or not. My other hope is that no woman will be beaten in the whole world, and certainly not in the name of God. I cannot see how I have done anything other than to elevate the Prophet and elevate the Koran by having it understood by more people.”

Aisha Bewley, who translated the Koran with her husband, said that they had opted for the translation “beat”. She said that the verse should be read only with a commentary that placed it in context.

“The best advice is that of the Prophet, who said ‘the worst of you are those who beat your wives’,” she said. Neal Robinson, a professor of Islamic studies, said that the translation of “daraba” as “hit” was inescapable.

He said: “There is a need to put passages like that in their historical context.”

In translation

“Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more [strength] than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in [the husband’s] absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them [first], [next] refuse to share their beds, [and last] chastise them [lightly]; but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means [of annoyance]: for Allah is Most High, Great [above you all].”

The Holy Qu’ran, translated by Abdullah Yusuf Ali (1934)

“Husbands should take good care of their wives, with [the bounties] God has given to some more than others and with what they spend out of their own money. Righteous wives are devout and guard what God would have them guard in their husband’s absence. If you fear high handedness from your wives, remind them [of the teachings of God], then ignore them when you go to bed, then hit them.*” *this signifies a single blow #

The Qu’ran, translated by M.A.S. Abdel Haleem (2004)


“Men are supporters of wives because God has given some of them an advantage over others and because they spend of their wealth. So the ones who are in accord with morality are the ones who are morally obligated, the ones who guard the unseen of what God has kept safe. But those whose resistance you fear, then admonish them and abandon them in their sleeping place, then go away from them; and if they obey you, look not for any way against them”

The Sublime Quran, translated by Laleh Bakhtiar (2007)


From The Times
March 31, 2007
Sean O’Neill

SOURCE
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Old 10-25-2007, 10:44 AM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

Heh, I think we have alot of other bigger problems than something as MINISCULE as this. If all of us try to improve ourselves, individually then there wouldn't be a NEED for such things. Just my 2cent.
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:02 AM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

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Originally Posted by TariqBinSleepin View Post
Heh, I think we have alot of other bigger problems that something as MINISCULE as this. If all of us try to improve ourselves, individually then there wouldn't be a NEED for such things. Just my 2cent.
If you think there are other bigger things than trying to understand the Qur'an and knowing one's faith so that you can address people when they have misconceptions about it, then good for you.

Whether there's a 'need for such things' or not is irrelevant, as 'such things' are obviously already happening.

Let's try not to have the typical Muslim response to everything here - i.e. 'let's bury our heads in the sand and not think outside our narrow little boxes so we don't have to think about or answer any searching questions about our faith.'
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Old 10-25-2007, 11:45 AM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

This isn't minuscule, its a bone of contention made by a lot of haters all around the world, and its also a verse abused by many men seeking to justify their retarded and violent behavior towards their wives.

At least the Times quoted Aisha Bewley when she said:
Quote:
“The best advice is that of the Prophet, who said ‘the worst of you are those who beat your wives’,” she said.
That's the standard by which all men should orient their actions by. You wanna be the best you can be, so be the best as Prophet Muhammad defined it, and he said the best of men are those who are best to their wives.
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Old 10-25-2007, 12:23 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

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Originally Posted by Pushpa View Post
If you think there are other bigger things than trying to understand the Qur'an and knowing one's faith so that you can address people when they have misconceptions about it, then good for you.

Whether there's a 'need for such things' or not is irrelevant, as 'such things' are obviously already happening.

Let's try not to have the typical Muslim response to everything here - i.e. 'let's bury our heads in the sand and not think outside our narrow little boxes so we don't have to think about or answer any searching questions about our faith.'
No, I didnt mean it in that sense. What i was saying is, these people criticizing and trying to interpret the QURAN what credentials do they have? Sure interpret it as you like im not sticking my head in the sand bag, im just saying at the moment, when Islam is under scrutiny and being looked down upon, this is the exact type of articles that not only make the people with weaker deen and faith start to questioning themselves but also allow the non-muslims to percieve islam as being intolerant. Ok sure mayb im blowing it out of proportion but, things lead up to other things which lead up to other things...You got me in the wrong sense sis >.<"
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Old 10-25-2007, 12:56 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pushpa View Post
If you think there are other bigger things than trying to understand the Qur'an and knowing one's faith so that you can address people when they have misconceptions about it, then good for you.

Whether there's a 'need for such things' or not is irrelevant, as 'such things' are obviously already happening.

Let's try not to have the typical Muslim response to everything here - i.e. 'let's bury our heads in the sand and not think outside our narrow little boxes so we don't have to think about or answer any searching questions about our faith.'

salam,

That's perfectly said, Masha-Allah. Thanks for posting the article. Here is Laleh Bakhtiar's official website:

The Sublime Quran » In the Name of God, the Merciful, the Compassionate
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Old 10-25-2007, 01:05 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

If she did this unqualified (mis)-translation for the sake of the people, then from them she will receive her worthless acclaim, awards, and pats on the back. And all those who err because of her deliberate actions, she will also be responsible for.

If she did it sincerely for Allah, yet committed a sincere mistake, then her reward is with Him.
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Old 10-25-2007, 01:38 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

I find the new version more agreeable.
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Old 10-25-2007, 03:52 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

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I find the new version more agreeable.
Ditto.
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Old 10-25-2007, 06:05 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

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Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah View Post
This isn't minuscule, its a bone of contention made by a lot of haters all around the world, and its also a verse abused by many men seeking to justify their retarded and violent behavior towards their wives.

At least the Times quoted Aisha Bewley when she said:
That's the standard by which all men should orient their actions by. You wanna be the best you can be, so be the best as Prophet Muhammad defined it, and he said the best of men are those who are best to their wives.
But how do you explain the relevance of the ayah? surely you can't just ignore it. They don't negate each other out because they both exist.

I've heard of other interpretations of the word but they always seem like...excuses.
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Old 10-25-2007, 06:15 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

salam,

This interpretation is also explained at this link:

Qur'anic Verse 4:34
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Old 10-25-2007, 06:24 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

'New' Qur'an huh. Have we turned into Christians all of a sudden to have two different Qur'ans?

New translation would have been more accurate donchaknow

I guess the press thrive on misleading headlines nowadays
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Old 10-25-2007, 07:36 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

The orthodox Islamic take on wife beating:

Wife Beating In Islam
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Old 10-25-2007, 07:37 PM
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Default Re: Wife-beating rejected in 'new' Koran

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Originally Posted by Bluestar View Post
But how do you explain the relevance of the ayah? surely you can't just ignore it. They don't negate each other out because they both exist.

I've heard of other interpretations of the word but they always seem like...excuses.
Its an allowance [and to what extent, I wont bother getting into] but the hadith itself clearly states which is the better of the two options.

Personally I never really believed much in forcing people via harsh commands to do something, this or that. My own younger brothers and sisters, if they're not doing something or acting improper, I'll just advise them or tell them whatever, and then let them make their own decision and face the consequences.

And as for beating, heck no.

If you have a problem with your wife, then you talk to her about it. Women are emotional creatures, so you appeal to what makes sense to them emotionally, along with whatever logical rationale you want to use. And if you don't have the skills to communicate effectively and come to an agreeable conclusion with her, then you are deficient, to put it simply.

Get some skills.
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Old 10-25-2007, 08:30 PM
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