[GOTFIVEONIT]

turkey's military sounds alot like pakistan's military lol

"It is also expected to weaken the powers of the army, which has pushed four governments from power since 1960."



Turkish PM to decide on headscarf ban

Monday, 17 September 2007

Istanbul, September 17: A controversial decision on whether Turkey’s new constitution will allow headscarves in universities will be left to the prime minister as a commission drafting the charter failed to reach agreement, media reported.

Secularists, including the powerful army, see the use of the headscarf at universities as a threat to the secular order. They accuse the newly re-elected AK Party, whose roots are in political Islam, of trying to undermine secularism, and the new constitution is seen as the next source of tension.

Although Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan is known to favour lifting the ban, it is not clear which way he will decide now. The AK Party tried to loosen the ban on headscarves after coming to power in 2002 but abandoned the idea after secularist pressure.

Leading newspaper Hurriyet and CNN Turk reported on Sunday that the commission drafting the constitution could not agree on whether the new charter should allow headscarves in universities and so would leave it up to Erdogan.

The draft constitution will be discussed by the party leadership on Wednesday and presented to the public in the next week, AK Party Deputy Chairman Dengir Mir Mehmet Firat told reporters on Sunday, declining to give details on the contents.

‘We have tried to create a constitution that will be accepted by all sectors of society,’ he said after three days of drafting by party members and academics at a country retreat.

Headscarves in mainly Muslim Turkey are banned in public buildings, universities and schools but some 60 percent of women cover their heads and the AK Party’s grassroots supporters want the ban lifted. Erdogan’s wife wears the headscarf and his daughter studied in the United States where she was allowed to cover up.

The wife of President Abdullah Gul whose candidacy was opposed by the secularists took Turkey to the European Court of Human Rights over the ban, while his daughter prompted controversy by wearing a headscarf at her graduation ceremony.

Plans to rewrite Turkey’s military era constitution were part of the AK Party’s manifesto for the July 22 parliamentary election, which it won with 47 percent of the vote.

The party says the new draft will focus on individual freedom and improving democracy. It is also expected to weaken the powers of the army, which has pushed four governments from power since 1960.

-Agencies




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[YOUSUFofSD]

we can only hope that the muslim party can keep changing things from the very secularist country that it is. so far the revivalism of islam seems to be growing though alhumdillah.

[GOTFIVEONIT]

Originally Posted by YOUSUFofSD

we can only hope that the muslim party can keep changing things from the very secularist country that it is. so far the revivalism of islam seems to be growing though alhumdillah.

I wouldnt call that secularism, i would call it, communist-style, state-sanctioned athiesm.

[Ugur]

Originally Posted by GOTFIVEONIT

I wouldnt call that secularism, i would call it, communist-style, state-sanctioned athiesm.

I am sorry but you are wrong, brother. The European Court of Human Rights has long decided that the headscarf ban in turkish universities is not a breach of human rights. That is, you don't need to be a communist to support the hijab ban and state-sponsored atheism in Turkey. Being a democratic secular and otherwise liberal European intellectual suffices.

It is true that Europeans do not ban hijab in universities in their own countries. But that doesn't show that they are for freedom. The reason for my judgement is simple: They don't ban it in their own countries but they are happy with the ban in Turkey, a Muslim country! Why do the democratic secular Europeans show this seemingly inconsistent attitude? The answer is, there is no inconsistency: They don't need to ban the hijab/headscarf in Europe yet because Islam is not a great threat in those countries yet . But they are for the ban in Turkey because they see Islam and Muslims in Turkey as very strong and very dangerous.

So, let us stop deluding ourselves and believing that anything good and sympathetic toward Islam can come from the west. The West is pure enmity to Allah.

[GOTFIVEONIT]

So, let us stop deluding ourselves and believing that anything good and sympathetic toward Islam can come from the west. The West is pure enmity to Allah.

you cannot condemn an entire group of people simply because thier way of life is vastly different from our own. that's wrong, its as wrong as racists who attack us on the streets because we appear different to them.

[Ugur]

Originally Posted by GOTFIVEONIT

you cannot condemn an entire group of people simply because thier way of life is vastly different from our own. that's wrong, its as wrong as racists who attack us on the streets because we appear different to them.

I am talking about the general secular western establishment, the political and legal elites, and not all westerners the majority of whom are naive commoners. I think I am offering enough evidence in the above post for that judgement.

[roberto]

Originally Posted by YOUSUFofSD

we can only hope that the muslim party can keep changing things from the very secularist country that it is. so far the revivalism of islam seems to be growing though alhumdillah.

Yet you, well your parents anyway, choose to live in a secular country

[GOTFIVEONIT]

Originally Posted by Ugur

I am talking about the general secular western establishment, the political and legal elites, and not all westerners the majority of whom are naive commoners. I think I am offering enough evidence in the above post for that judgement.

hehehe brother, with a fanatical christian like bush in the white house, america, the leader of the western world, could hardly be called 'secular'.

[Ugur]

Originally Posted by GOTFIVEONIT

hehehe brother, with a fanatical christian like bush in the white house, america, the leader of the western world, could hardly be called 'secular'.

The American system is secular. Without Bush actually banning the theory of evolution in the whole of country and instituting a Christian state, you can't say that America is a Christian state and not secular.

[zzze]

assalamu alaykum

I'm not sure, he's believed to have said that he's left his 'political islam behind.' In turkey, this may well mean banning the hijaab as most believe it more appropriate to leave your faith behind closed doors...i really hope he doesn't, obviously.