Mandatory Military Service

[ChotooMotoo]

Hanbali said

Sister Chotooo Motoo, I apologize if I came across as harsh. Forgive me.

I also did not mean to diminish being poor. May Allah [swt] bless those who persevere in times of poorness.

My only contention, dear sister, is that there is no justification for lifting a gun, pointing it at a fellow Muslim, and firing it at the behest of the army of tawagheet.

There are many ways out of this, and one merely needs to be creative.

And by the way, I don't find this "un-american". Civil disobedience is part of the American tradition.

May Allah [swt] unite our hearts on the Siratul Mustaqeem.

Sister PhDGirl, I am an IMG so I don't know much about how things work in America. I will have to do some investigation before I can come to a conclusion as to what the proper course of action would be. Having said that, what does this have to do with me anyways? Islamic rulings do not change simply because of me. Anyways, I will get back to you on this issue when I investigate it further, insha-Allah. May Allah [swt] reward you.

You should appologize. Your good luck doesn't mean that I didn't shop around. I live in the middle of freaking no-where land. I have to first travel from po-dunkville to a big city. That's expensive. The overseas ticket itself is pretty cheap (jee, I think I said that already in a previous post). Just imagine, my friend got a ticket from San Fancisco to Malaysia for like $700. If you buy your ticket at the wrong time, or the airlines are being &^$%^$#^$*@ a DOMESTIC ticket from my house to my mom's house can cost $500 OR MORE! Last summer I had get a ticket back to another po-dunk town to defend my M.S. Thesis, and they were quoting me $1000 for that ticket. WHAT THE *(&*^!!!!! I did finally manage to get it down to $500, but OH!!! It's FREAKING REDICULOUS!!!! I want to buy a ticket for my mom to stay with me in September, and I'm looking at a minimum of $300, and there is only one layover!

When International carriers with new planes and high wages can make huge profits selling tickets for $1000 or less, I just don't buy that domestic carriers are really in financial duress. I think they are horribly managed, and their top echelon are being terribly overpaid, and that's the ONLY reason why they raise their prices so rediculously high, have crappy service, and old planes.

I understand your position, and I hope that you are sincere and stand by it. Not all forms of military service require killing someone. My dad got drafted in Vietnam, a war he considered unjust and illegal. While he did get out of it for medical reasons, had he been forced to serve, he would have done his utmost to get a non-combat role. What I'm not clear about from your stance, is if you believe a non-combat role, especially if it's not even in the line of fire, is as damning as a combat role. Ph.D. girls question about working for the VA for instance.

I can actually see a huge benefit for Islam and huge opportunity for Dawah being a Muslim serving in the army. I certainly believe that soldiers these days are totally indoctrinated against Islam and Muslims. If you are serving a non-combat role, for instance in the V.A. Hosptial, or a service role on an aircraft carrier, you have a chance to show them that Muslims aren't the evil sub-human monsters they have been taught about. I'm not saying it's right to join the military, I didn't join when I was 18 even though my mom wanted me too (before I was Muslim BTW, she wanted me to join for the free college education and all that), and I wouldn't encourage my kids to join ever, but maybe that's the justification some kids feel when they join. Maybe that's the justification people who got drafted in Vietnam, even when it was against their beliefs, used to placate themselves.

[Hanbali]

PhDGirl said

The reason I'm asking about the residency programs is that you are being very harsh with others who join or support the military, yet you are seeking out a career which will involve you doing the very same thing.

Please don't exaggerate. "the very same thing" puh-lease. Do you even believe yourself when you say this?

Somehow you are equating doing a medical residency with fighting against Muslims in Iraq?

Is it okay for you to do but not others?

Who the hell said that?

You might be an IMG, but you were raised in the US and are seeking to do residency and practice here, so you really should know how things work.

Ummm, no. I have a vague idea obviously but there is no reason to assume that I know that every residency program in America requires some time at a VA hospital, a fact which we still need to confirm. This is a minute detail and there is no reason that an IMG would know this. Go take 10 IMGs--even 10 American IMGs--and ask them this question, and I'd bet that a good number of them wouldn't know this.

What I'm not clear about from your stance, is if you believe a non-combat role, especially if it's not even in the line of fire, is as damning as a combat role.

A non-combat role is obviously less sinful than a combat role.

[TrentReznor858]

Hanbali said

S
Sister PhDGirl, I am an IMG so I don't know much about how things work in America..

I think thats painfully obvious

[zzze]

assalamu alaykum

....i'd only fight for something i believe in and that's only likely to happen if an islamic state is established. I don't think free education would sell the idea of going to war (in the uk) as most people can afford to go to university (standard student loans).

on the topic of hijra (does any hijra count these days?) a western person with a degree can afford to move to foreign countries to teach english, esp in saudi where they pay british and americans more than anyone else. they pay for flights etc.

[Good_ol_JR]

shadha said

AsSalamu' Alaykum,

So I got into a conversation with a Pastor Dave [yes like the character but I kid you not, that was his name ] at my job. I liked the man right off the bat. He was very well-rounded, thoughtful with his words, and very sharp.

He was telling me of his experience in Eritrea [Asmara is the capital and sounds so beautiful with a beautiful meaning, it is now on top of my most wanted female baby names but moving on... ] and describing to me the turmoil the country is in. I forgot how but we began on the conversation of government enforced military enlistment. I didn't hold back. I firmly gave my opinion on it, which thankfully he agreed 110% with.

Do you think the governments of the US, UK & Canada should have an enforced military enlistment upon turning a certain age [such as the age 18]?

I absolutely think so, ESPECIALLY in America. No this has nothing to do with the wars at hand [hell, I don't think those who are apart of the forced enlistment should be deployed to combat zones], but more about the sheer level of arrogance, brattiness, entitlement, and immediate gratification syndrome the children/criminals/parasites of this country are so dreadfully suffering from. They need structure, they need discipline, they need exercise, they need to feel that they are accountable for their actions, and they need to grow the hell up. Hell, as part of serving, they should be given a free college education. See, we hit so many birds with one stone.

Thoughts?


shadha-

This guy Brian Stann is a good example of the ideal result from this post. He's a Captain in the Marines and has served 2 tours in Iraq, he won a silver star for courage by leading all 42 under his command out of an enemy trap after 4 days of holding out, he also has a degree in Economics, and is currently the WEC Light Heavyweight Champion (205 lbs).

Brian Stann Iraq veteran and WEC champion on CNN (Video) at UFC blog for UFC news, results, videos, rumors, fights, pics and tickets — MMAmania.com

I obviously don't agree with the war he's fighting, but I think all us Muslims should view him as competition. Many of us are leading pointless, one-dimensional lives we should try to compete with this guy. To Jaysh and the Jihadis how do you think you'd fair if you came across this guy in the field of Jihad? InshAllah a few years from now you'll have no problem answering this question, but right now you guys, as well as myself and the rest of Islamica better get to work.

As they say in the marines: ooraa

[TrentReznor858]

Good_ol_JR said

This guy Brian Stann is a good example of the ideal result from this post. He's a Captain in the Marines and has served 2 tours in Iraq, he won a silver star for courage by leading all 42 under his command out of an enemy trap after 4 days of holding out, he also has a degree in Economics, and is currently the WEC Light Heavyweight Champion (205 lbs).

Brian Stann Iraq veteran and WEC champion on CNN (Video) at UFC blog for UFC news, results, videos, rumors, fights, pics and tickets — MMAmania.com

I obviously don't agree with the war he's fighting, but I think all us Muslims should view him as competition. Many of us are leading pointless, one-dimensional lives we should try to compete with this guy. To Jaysh and the Jihadis how do you think you'd fair if you came across this guy in the field of Jihad? InshAllah a few years from now you'll have no problem answering this question, but right now you guys, as well as myself and the rest of Islamica better get to work.

As they say in the marines: ooraa

I am not even a fan of this guy's fighting style or anything, but he could mop the floor with all of these tough guys on this forum combined.

[shadha]

GoodolJR: Brian Stann Iraq veteran and WEC champion on CNN (Video) at UFC blog for UFC news, results, videos, rumors, fights, pics and tickets — MMAmania.com

Nice.

His force is mesmerizing.

I the UFC.


shadha-

[Variable]

Good_ol_JR said

This guy Brian Stann is a good example of the ideal result from this post. He's a Captain in the Marines and has served 2 tours in Iraq, he won a silver star for courage by leading all 42 under his command out of an enemy trap after 4 days of holding out, he also has a degree in Economics, and is currently the WEC Light Heavyweight Champion (205 lbs).

Brian Stann Iraq veteran and WEC champion on CNN (Video) at UFC blog for UFC news, results, videos, rumors, fights, pics and tickets — MMAmania.com

I obviously don't agree with the war he's fighting, but I think all us Muslims should view him as competition. Many of us are leading pointless, one-dimensional lives we should try to compete with this guy. To Jaysh and the Jihadis how do you think you'd fair if you came across this guy in the field of Jihad? InshAllah a few years from now you'll have no problem answering this question, but right now you guys, as well as myself and the rest of Islamica better get to work.

As they say in the marines: ooraa

That guy graduated from Annapolis, I don't think he really fits into what the op was all about. But yeh, he looks like a pretty mean marine mofo.

[Revert]

Good_ol_JR said

This guy Brian Stann is a good example of the ideal result from this post. He's a Captain in the Marines and has served 2 tours in Iraq, he won a silver star for courage by leading all 42 under his command out of an enemy trap after 4 days of holding out, he also has a degree in Economics, and is currently the WEC Light Heavyweight Champion (205 lbs).

Brian Stann Iraq veteran and WEC champion on CNN (Video) at UFC blog for UFC news, results, videos, rumors, fights, pics and tickets — MMAmania.com

I obviously don't agree with the war he's fighting, but I think all us Muslims should view him as competition. Many of us are leading pointless, one-dimensional lives we should try to compete with this guy. To Jaysh and the Jihadis how do you think you'd fair if you came across this guy in the field of Jihad? InshAllah a few years from now you'll have no problem answering this question, but right now you guys, as well as myself and the rest of Islamica better get to work.

As they say in the marines: ooraa

I don't like his style either but yeah..he could kick everyone apart from probably 3 peoples ass on this forum...

[TrentReznor858]

Revert said

I don't like his style either but yeah..he could kick everyone apart from probably 3 peoples ass on this forum...

Unless any of them are in the UFC, hes mopping the floor with them too

[Revert]

TrentReznor858 said

Unless any of them are in the UFC, hes mopping the floor with them too

I've said it many times bro UFC and the street are 2 different fish.

[TrentReznor858]

Revert said

I've said it many times bro UFC and the street are 2 different fish.

Just because they arent allowed to break bowns, dislocate, dismember, etc IN THE UFC doesnt mean they wouldnt in a street fight.

[shadha]

Revert: I've said it many times bro UFC and the street are 2 different fish.

Three people? And who are these three people?

Anyway, I agree with Trent on this one. There are rules and regulations in the cage unlike on the street.


shadha-

[Jaysh]

What in the world happened to this thread lol....suddenly it's about UFC lol

[frosama]

I really hope you are being sarcastic. If we ever needed to engage in combat with people similar to this, we don't need experience or "muscles" , we only need the help of allah.

We don't have much to learn from someone who has thrown his life away. He's got a degree in economics and he's fighting in the UFC... Doesn't seem like someone I would strive to be like, I thank allah(swt) that I haven't ended up like he has. The only people I want to compete with are those with high iman.


I mean doesn't it make you sick looking at UFC fighting... they basically fight in their underpants and grapple each other into submission. I wouldn't even be surprised if it was fake and all planned ahead of time.