[Jack_Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

I don't think there actually are any wahhabis in Pakistan. Are you talking about Ahl-e-Hadith?

My bad, I honestly forgot you kept steady and accurate count of wahabis in Pakistan. If you wish I will retract my comment in the face of your stern and supergenius like logic.


I will from now on assume that suicide bombings and radical terrorists are the work of shias, ahmedis and ofcourse musharraf. duh

[Jamroll]

Originally Posted by Jack_Sparrow

My bad, I honestly forgot you kept steady and accurate count of wahabis in Pakistan. If you wish I will retract my comment in the face of your stern and supergenius like logic.


I will from now on assume that suicide bombings and radical terrorists are the work of shias, ahmedis and ofcourse musharraf. duh

Bro, what's with the attiutude? I just think the term "wahhabi" is thrown around too often, without fully understanding what the term means.

[Aryan_]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

Bro, what's with the attiutude? I just think the term "wahhabi" is thrown around too often, without fully understanding what the term means.

Wahabbi is the name given to groups thugs who's many acts of extremism include attacking and killing Muslims in the name of Islam, taken from the radical anti-Turkish sect that existed in the 18th century. Don't see what's wrong with the term.

[Jack_Sparrow]

Aryanna,

you literally didn't have to explain that friendo. This is the trap argument: "there is no such thing as wahabism...o i dont know what you people are talking about"

sparrow

[Jamroll]

Originally Posted by Aryan_

Wahabbi is the name given to groups thugs who's many acts of extremism include attacking and killing Muslims in the name of Islam, taken from the radical anti-Turkish sect that existed in the 18th century. Don't see what's wrong with the term.

There's nothing wrong with the term, per se, as long as its used correctly. There is, however, a trend amongst some people to use it as a blanket statement to refer to anyone they regard as more radical or extreme than themselves, so for example, to someone who is uber-secular, just about everyone who goes to the mosque, or fasts at Ramadhan is a wahhabi. It's even used to describe the "other", or anyone that is simply not liked.

Also, there is a danger of erroneously or deliberately conflating distinct and separate groups. It's similar to when every single Muslim resistance or militant group is referred to as "al-Qaeda". Is every single group out there al-Qaeda? Of course not. The same applies with this blanket wahhabi label. It's a clumsy and lazy label, and doesn't add anything to the discourse, other than creating black-and-white dichotomies which confuse the issue.

[Jack_Sparrow]

[MaleFashionista]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

I don't think there actually are any wahhabis in Pakistan. Are you talking about Ahl-e-Hadith?

I agree that the term 'Wahabi' is often thrown around by people (both Muslim and otherwise) without understanding what exactly it refers to...

But how are you claiming there are no Wahabis in Pakistan? As far as I know, the term is a somewhat pejorative moniker for Salafis...who in South Asia like to refer to themselves as Ahl-e-Hadis.

[Spice]

Wahabi=Salafi=Alh-e-Hadeeth

They're all the same people.

[Jamroll]

Originally Posted by MaleFashionista

I agree that the term 'Wahabi' is often thrown around by people (both Muslim and otherwise) without understanding what exactly it refers to...

But how are you claiming there are no Wahabis in Pakistan? As far as I know, the term is a somewhat pejorative moniker for Salafis...who in South Asia like to refer to themselves as Ahl-e-Hadis.

Well, that's the thing, bro. I'm challenging the use of it as a perjorative moniker because I feel there's more complexities involved than the moniker allows. Also, the nuances of labelling particular extremist groups aside, I also think it's an incredibly lazy way to refer to any one we don't like or who we regard as more radical than ourselves. Please see my previous post.

[m_ali_qazi]

Originally Posted by Aryan_

Wahabbi is the name given to groups thugs who's many acts of extremism include attacking and killing Muslims in the name of Islam, taken from the radical anti-Turkish sect that existed in the 18th century. Don't see what's wrong with the term.

correction: wahabbi is the name FALSELY given.........

mashallah we have thugs and extremists from all sects of islam

[MaleFashionista]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

Well, that's the thing, bro. I'm challenging the use of it as a perjorative moniker because I feel there's more complexities involved than the moniker allows. Also, the nuances of labelling particular extremist groups aside, I also think it's an incredibly lazy way to refer to any one we don't like or who we regard as more radical than ourselves. Please see my previous post.

So then how do you define a Wahabi?

[Jamroll]

Originally Posted by MaleFashionista

So then how do you define a Wahabi?

Well for starters, even the people that we might correctly call Wahhabi object to the label. It doesn't really make sense to call people Wahhabi, when they keep saying "Despite our beliefs, we don't like to be called Wahhabi". It's for this reason, that "wahhabi" is a derogatory term from the get-go, since no-one wants to be labelled as such.

But even then, if we put that to one side, and say clearly there are some people that are wahhabi, I would say that it is probably best used to describe a group of people who primarily follow the teachings of Muhammad ibn Abdul Wahhab, the guy from the 18th century. Despite Wahhabi and Salafi being used interchangeably, I think at best we can say that Wahhabis are a particular group or a particular strain of thought within the Salafi movement. I see it as a specifically Gulf Arab phenomenon, particularly Saudi Arabia, even though we can accept that different groups in other areas may have been influenced by their teachings.

Also, if we look at groups that are commonly referred to as Wahhabi, such as al-Qaeda, and scratch beneath the surface, we would see that Bin Laden and his ilk are more influenced by the teachings of Syed Qutb. In fact, most of these extremist groups are influenced by Qutb's writings, who as far as I know was not a Wahhabi at all.

In the Indian subcontinent "wahhabi" is even used as a slur against people who follow the Deobandi school, which is plainly ridiculous.

[m_ali_qazi]

Originally Posted by Jamroll

Also, if we look at groups that are commonly referred to as Wahhabi, such as al-Qaeda, and scratch beneath the surface, we would see that Bin Laden and his ilk are more influenced by the teachings of Syed Qutb. In fact, most of these extremist groups are influenced by Qutb's writings, who as far as I know was not a Wahhabi at all.

but i dont think being influenced by qutb would make anyone any less wahabi or any less sufi since qutb's and ikhwan's emphasis is not really on aqeedah and fiqh

[Jack_Sparrow]

While we are on the subject, here is a definition of The Latter Day Wahabiites

A confused western born muslim, usually born and raised in the well off and comforting western suburbs that displays a strong desire to emulate Arabic culture (skirt wearing, emulating arabic accent, memorizing arabic lingo...thining its religion) and style through "Extremist" fashion and generally accepted "Wahabish" guiding principles.

[Aryan_]

How would you describe a Vandal?