[dreamdeferred]

I chalk it up to patriarchy.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Tairra

with that thrid somewhat paragraph where you stated "In Islam, there is greater valueplaced on the chaste behavior of women than on men -a s seen from the fact that its a major sin to accuse a Muslim woman of unchastity, but it is not the same for a man. " Why is that?

Honestly I haven't thought about it much. Its just the way it is in Islam, and I take it no questions asked. It might be because the woman is the one who gets pregnant if the unchaste behavior goes too far. And with Islam's emphasis on family, an illegitimate child out of wedlock complicates things.

I mean it appears now (and its true) that more men are behaving more un chaste than women.

Do you have anything to back up your statement? Any statistics? I know, and know about, plenty of girls who are pretty loose. Still, I have never, ever presumed that this means one gender is being more unchaste than the other.

Originally Posted by Tairra

so then why did you state it if Im in agreeance with you?

You're not.

You are asking why there's more emphasis on women acting properly than men ... and I'm asking why the big fuss? Why are people objecting to that emphasis? Are you searching for some equilibrium?

[Tairra]

Well you wouldnt understand because your not female, nor are you really trying to understand. The emphasis need to be made so that both genders will be treated the same fashion and not one feeling as if they are higher and arent not subject to acting in such fashion.

[Tairra]

well Ill put it this way, if a guy makes a mistake with a female, the one who gets punished the most and has to deal with it the rest of her life on this earth ( the guy if he doesnt get punished here, he will in the here after if certain things arent done) is the female while the men go on with their everday lives. Hmmm to think about it, so can we say that they'll have a harsher punishment in the here after since they arent really getting much punishment in this dunya?

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Tairra

Well you wouldnt understand because your not female, nor are you really trying to understand.

Instead of relying on such excuses, why not take a time-out and go read up on the subject matter some more, take in a broad range of views on it to increase your familiarity and expertise on the same, learn how to articulate your stance more clearly and then come back and try again?

The emphasis need to be made so that both genders will be treated the same fashion and not one feeling as if they are higher and arent not subject to acting in such fashion.

Are you saying Islam's guidance on gender issues is unjust?

Please keep in mind that fair and equal treatment of both genders does not mean identical treatment.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Tairra

well Ill put it this way, if a guy makes a mistake with a female, the one who gets punished the most and has to deal with it the rest of her life on this earth ( the guy if he doesnt get punished here, he will in the here after if certain things arent done) is the female while the men go on with their everday lives. Hmmm to think about it, so can we say that they'll have a harsher punishment in the here after since they arent really getting much punishment in this dunya?

Can you give an example from Islam where the female is punished the most?

[Tairra]

one the female is critized most, point blank, you dont hear about men bein buried alive you hear about the women. Two the woman has to take care of the child (thats the life long punishment/ blessing) that she has, now I know the men are suppose to take help take care of it, but dude a lot of men dont. And they get to run off and live their life. I know a brother who has done it, and it sickens me.

[ChotooMotoo]

Originally Posted by IbnMardhiyah

Can you give an example from Islam where the female is punished the most?

I think her whole point is about the behavior of MUSLIMS not Islam itself. She's saying that MUSLIMS have a tendency to interpret Islam in a sexist fashion that overemphasises women's behavior compared to men's.. Islamically, the actual punishment for zina is the same for men and women. Culturally, not so much.

[Tairra]

Originally Posted by ChotooMotoo

I think her whole point is about the behavior of MUSLIMS not Islam itself. She's saying that MUSLIMS have a tendency to interpret Islam in a sexist fashion that overemphasises women's behavior compared to men's.. Islamically, the actual punishment for zina is the same for men and women. Culturally, not so much.

Thanks for clearing it up, but thats exactly what I meant.

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Tairra

one the female is critized most, point blank,

... probably because the potential effects of unchaste behavior is more apparent in women than in men? Who are you going to blame for that?

you dont hear about men bein buried alive you hear about the women.

No, I don't hear about anyone being buried alive, but that possibly means I live in a cave. Where are these women being buried alive, that you hear about?

Two the woman has to take care of the child (thats the life long punishment/ blessing) that she has, now I know the men are suppose to take help take care of it, but dude a lot of men dont. And they get to run off and live their life. I know a brother who has done it, and it sickens me.

I'm still having difficulty understanding how this relates to the OP.

You asked if its "sexist" or not, and you can't really ask that question without objecting to the higher value that Islam places on women's chastity than men's.

You know ... men have plenty of things we could complain about too, if we were wired like women. But we don't, because we know God is fair and just, and has not put a burden on any soul that it cannot bear.

So take a hint.

[Tairra]

You know what, I already explained myself and chootoo totally clarified what I meant, so I'm not going to go any further with you, its just a waste of time.

[Tairra]

Take The Hint, Im Not Saying Islam, I'm Saying The People.

[LEGALEAGLE]

Originally Posted by Tairra

Thanks for clearing it up, but thats exactly what I meant.

Are you saying the world is an unfair place ?

[IbnMardhiyah]

Originally Posted by Tairra

You know what, I already explained myself and chootoo totally clarified what I meant, so I'm not going to go any further with you, its just a waste of time.

If you cannot clearly articulate your stance, your opinion, your thoughts, and so forth, and if you cannot make statements that stand up to academic scrutiny or peer review, then why bother making them at all?

What you're saying isn't anything new - there's probably half a dozen threads on post-crash Islamica that deal with this exact topic. Try looking through those threads to refine your presentation.

[Tairra]

Originally Posted by LEGALEAGLE