Quote:
Originally Posted by Salahadeen
Khairan, do you not have a problem when Rahat does this:
He is invoking Allah and sending curses down upon other Muslims. I hope you know what a curse is......it's very harsh, on the same level as doing takfeer.
|
In fact I don't agree with rahat on this matter, and we have discussed this at length on the open forums.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salahadeen
I didn't say you, Khairan. I said "Shi`as", by which I meant twelvers, not you. You came to the defense of twelvers, so I responded in that manner.
|
If this were a discussion of twelvers making takfir on sunnis simply for being sunni I would feel the same -- and I have not shied away from saying as much in past discussions. I'm not concerned with "sect" here -- I am concerned with people believing they can monopolize Submission when in fact it is only the Master of the Universe who knows which of His creation is truly in Islam.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salahadeen
Go read a history book.
|
I know my history. I know that the Qur'an warned the first muslims (and through them, us) constantly of the dangers of Nifaq within the community, and that the Prophet himself was aware of traitors among his people. The Prophet apparently did not wish to create a culture of suspicion and witch hunts, however, because he insisted always that people who declared Islam were to be treated as Muslims.
There is the hadith of the man who asked the Prophet whether he should spare the life of a man whom he was fighting in battle and, gaining power over him, he found his enemy declaring the shahadah, and to whom the Prophet replied that he must accept his enemy's shahadah even in the heat of battle.
People have spoken of their "right" to make takfir upon shias because shias "make war" upon sunnis -- however, this not only ignores the long history of *mutual* violence that lies between the two communities but also assumes shias
a priori have less of a right to be muslim: indeed, it is BECAUSE it is assumed that the shia claim to Islam is tenuous at best that sunnis can see themselves as the standard of Islam and see any shia violence against themselves as tantamount to an attack upon "the ummah" and Islam directly.