Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanbali
Ali Fazel, do not accuse me of lying. I did not deny that you believe that God is ultimately in control.
Rather, I merely said that you ask the Prophet [s] and Ali [ra] for help. You say "Ya Ali Maddad" and "Ya Ali, grant us rain". This is a statement of shirk and kufr which expels one outside the folds of Islam. There can be no majazi interpretation of statements of kufr.
Even the pagans used to say that ultimately Allah [swt] was the one who helped them, and that their idols were merely intermediaries. They would call out "ya uzza, grant us rain", even though they believed that ultimately it was Allah [swt] with whose permission everything was done.
As for the Prophet [s] being alive, we've discussed this a million times on this forum. Please don't keep bringing it up.
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No accusation to you -- Its a general speech -- those who claim they know what in the hearts of others and come out accusing others are liars - zalimeen.
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Although this thread is about Tawasul --- And I'd prefer to discuss tawasul only - this side issue has cropped up. Its natural considering the circumstance and the past hostilities between the two factions.
Lets stick to HARD LOGIC.
Every action depends on
Intention .
A person prays, with intention to worship Allah ----OR ---- With intention, to show others that he is pious.
A person gives sadka, with intention to please Allah ---- OR ---- with intention, to show others that he is generous.
The reward or punishment depends on the intention - not on the act. ---- <RIGHT>
So when a person knows very well that Allah (SWT) controls all affair - and he goes to grave of Prophet (SAWWS), and says "Ya Rasool-il-lah Madad - a3na maglub"
or he goes to the grave of Ali-ibn abi talib and say, "Ya Ali madad - a3na maghlub".
LOGIC dictated that he is saying O' Rusool-il-lah help me, intercede for me before Allah.
Mostly, these people who go to Prophet (SAWWS) consider themselves as sinners and they believe that Allah will not accept their pleas. BUT, if they go through Prophet (SAW) there is a better chances of getting their pleas heard.
How can any kadhi, sheik, mufti, mullah, hafiz ul qur'an, or what ever big titles they hold,
come out and tell us that they know what is in the hearts of these people?
How can they say, that these people are expecting prophet (SAWWS) or Ali (A) to grant them their wish,
bypassing Allah (SWT) --- How can they claim to know what's there in the hearts of these people?
He is a liar who says he can read the hearts of others.
And He who accuses others of fisk without proof, is a Zalim and mischief monger.
UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCE - referring to any group of muslimeen as grave worshippers without knowledge of their belief and their intention is wrong and a big fasaat.
Finally --- Some sayied Told me this story - You will find it interesting
[Ttranslation from one language to another does not do justice – I hope you will see the beauty of this message]
Quote:
From the mosque some people (pious in appearance), were coming out after their prayers.
They saw a handsome young man eating some thing and giving some to a beautiful lady in hijab, standing next to him.
They came shouting - you shameless person - what is this behaviour – don’t you feel shame?
The young man pleaded - What have I done wrong? - What sin have I committed, that you rebuke me like this?
You standing here in front of us, in front of this mosque, eating like this with this lady – and you are asking us, “what wrong I have done?”
The young man said, this lady is my Mother, under whose feet is my jannah. We are tired and hungry having walked a long distance ---- Is it a crime to share food with your mother?
These Namazis walked away, ashamed and disguisted at their own filthy thoughts.
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The mufti, mullah, molvi who accuse others of crime without knowledge and understanding are no different that these namazis with filthy thoughts.