Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanbali
How many times have we gone over this!?
And by the way, you grave worshippers do not do tawassul like the Sufis do. At least the Sufis just ask the occupant of the grave to ask Allah [swt] for them. (I still think that is wrong but at least they are directing their request to Allah [swt] in a convoluted way.) So they say "O Prophet , make du`a for me...."
On the other hand, you grave worshippers directly ask the occupant of the grave for things. You say "Ya Ali Madad" (O Ali, YOU help me). You ask him directly for things. Same way with the Prophet [s].
So the Sufis will say "O Prophet, pray to God to give us rain..."
Whereas you will say "O Prophet, give us rain!" Shirk akbar.
Because it is shirk.
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Hanbali --- You are 100% wrong in your statement.
You have no idea of our belief -- You are only talking from hearsay.
Only if you really researched you know where we stand.
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All control is in the hands of Allah (swt).
Musa (A) could not part the sea without Allah's will.
Isa (A) could not cure the lepers or bring the dead to life, without Allah's will.
Zulkernain could not build the wall to contain Ajuj and Majuj, without Allah’s will.
The almighty creator has total over all control of all affairs.
A dead leaf on the tree would not leave its place and descend to the ground without Allah's will.
Even Israeel could not take the soul out of the body of the beings, without Allah's will.
Gibraeel could not convey the wahy, without Allah's will.
Not even an electron can move an iota in its orbit round the nucleus without Allah’s will.
So where did you get this Idea that Shias say Ya Ali madad - they consider Ali can help without Allah's will?
These accusations are no different from the countless accusations that we heard before.
i.e. Shias have a different Qur'an – the accusers have yet not produced this so called Qur’an. ---- Shias believe gibrael made a mistake of conveying the prophet hood to Muhammad instead of Ali. ---No proof ever produced to support this accusation. Shias are idol worshipers. Shias are Kafir – Shia Imams are prophets.
Al Hamdu lilah – truth is powerful and Lies are weak --- Truth always manifests itself while the lies and liars are always discredit and stand humiliated.
This Accusation --- Shias are grave worshippers comes from such filthy hearts. I challenge you or any person reading this to produce proof to this effect. Prove that we worship the occupants of the grave. Prove that we consider them as deity.
Lying is mother of all sins – A curse of Allah is on the liars.
Those who call us Kafir have themselves moved out of the sunnah of Prophet (SAWWS). They are manufacturing new laws and adding new innovations into Islam. They are guilty of distorting the word of Allah and the teachings of Prophet (SAW). -- Show me one authentic tradition Hadith) or ayiet of Qur’an that supports this verdict of kufr against us.
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Back to the subject.
I repeat my question.
Prom the above post you declare that tawasul is valid in Islam..
On this forum on other thraeds you people said, Prophet (SAW) is alive in his grave.
So if I go to the grave of Prophet (SAW) to seek his help. What wrong in this?
(Know that Allah is Al mighty who controls all affairs and nothing bypasses his will.)
Why do the Saudi beat people who go to the grave of prophet (SAWWS)
I also asked a remote question ----- People in the grave are alive ---- Do they eat or drink?